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Home My WebLink AboutCCMin_59Apr91175 REGULAR MEETING APRIL 9th, 1959. Meeting was called to order at 7:00 P. M., the following Council Members being present: Harold C. Nilsen, Mayor; George J. Shavor, Trustee; Willis Warkentien, Trustee; Paul Coppini, Trustee and Wm. Utecht, Clerk. Also present were Frank N. Graham, Village Attorney; Wm. E. Olsen, Treasurer; Vern Ljungren, Village Engineer and Ethel E. White, Deputy Clerk and Deputy Treasurer. The Minutes of the special meeting of March 9th were approved as submitted. The Minutes of the Regular meeting of March 19th were approved as submitted. Hearing Mayor Nilsen read the following legal notice published in the Rose Rezoning Tribune March 26th, 1959, Affidavit of Publishing and Affidavit of Petition posting same notice at the three designated. posting places b4arch 20th, 1959. "LEGAL NOTICE VII.,LAGE OF FALCON HEIGHTS NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING: • Notice is hereby given that a public hearing will be held at 7:00 P. M. on Thursday, April 9th, 1959, before the Council of the Village of Falcon Heights at the Village Hall, 1614 W. Larpenteur Avenue, Falcon Heights, Minnesota, at which the petition dated February 10th, 1959, signed by Frank J. Collins and others, re- questing that the property described as: The westerly 285' of lot 8, Annie L. Hendrickson's Acre Lots, Ramsey County, Village of Falcon Heights, Minnesota, excepting from said tract the following described parts: (1) the north 850' of said tract; (2) the west b0' of the south 195' of said tract, and (3) the south 179' of said tract lying Easterly of the Westerly 60' of said tract be rezoned from Business District to Residence District "A", Sub3ect to the present non-conforming use. All persons interested in said proposed rezoning are hereby advised to attend the hearing at said time and place and to participate in the said meeting. The petition dated February 10th, signed by Frank J. Collins and others, was read as follows: Pursuant to Subsection (e) of Section 12 cif Ordinance No. 8 of the Village of Falcon Heights, MinnE~sota, to change the zoning of the following described tract of land located in Ramsey County, State of Minnesota, from a Business District Classification to a Residence District "A" classification: The westerly 285' of lot 8, Annie L. Hendrickson's Acre Lots, Ramsey County, Village of Falcon Heights, Minnesota, excepting from said tract the following described parts: (1) The north 850' of said tract; (2) the west 60' of the south 195' of said tract; and (3) the south 179' of said tract lying east- erly of the westerly 60' of said tract. Subject to the present non- conforming use. Dated: This 10th day of February 1959. This petition had been submitted to the Village Attorney who sub- mitted that it was in order. It was signed by the proper number of property owners, and therefore sufficient. Wm. Korstad, 1625 Garden., Spokesman for the this was a petition to rezone the north end It-does not involve any apartment buildings. anything but a hearing for the Council to re or the Lindig Property which constitutes all Larpenteur. We ask the Council to consider home building in Falcon Heights is concerned Petitioners, stated of the Lindig property. It does not involve zone the north portion but the front 179' facing the zoning so far as the . We do not think the 1176 "Spot Zoning" or local zoning is necessary or good for the community or legal. We have examined the present zoning as far as business district or commercial in Falcon Heights and we find a pretty straight strip of 175' butting along the north side of Larpenteur avenue. This is pretty close to uniform running along Larpenteur immediately to the north side. There is one noticeable exception to this approximately 175' and that is the Wm. Lindig property which goes back approximately l~35' off of Larpenteur. The Wm, Lindig property is not on a business corner such as Larpenteur and Snelling. The Lindig property goes into residential district. It did go into residential district at the time of its zoning. It is quite apparent that even though houses were not there, there were 3 lots marked. and zoned residential A immediately across from the Lindig property to the East so that whether there were houses immediately across from the Lindig property at the time of its rezoning, is immaterial. The point is that the surround- ing property was zoned residential ~ so that the long l~35' running down Fry goes right into ~°esidential area which was so zoned. There is another very noticeable point when you examine the zoning laws or the zoning map of Falcon Heights and that is that the Lindig property is primarily a greenhouse property and 3ret when you go further down to the west on Larpenteur you find the Killmer prop- erty which is a greenhouse, you find the Art Lindig property, you find the Hermes property which is a greenhouse and further down the Gibbs Nelson Greenhouse property and I think actually further down you come to other greenhouse properties. These are the main ones as I s ~e them, The odd part of it tivas that none of them are zoned commercial. I think if all the Wm. Lindig property is properly zoned commercial, then all the Killmer property should be zoned commercial, that all the Art Lindig Property, The Hermes property, the Gibbs Nelson prop- erty should be zoned commercial, and all of the other greenhouse property along Larpenteur should be zoned commercial. Then there would not be any discrimination. We believe as residents of Falcon Heights that there is discrimin- ation, not only to the local residents in the immediate area of the Y~'m. Lindig property by having all of the S"7m. Lindig property zoned commercial but there is also gross discrimination against all the other Greenhouse property. There is something wrong. Something happened back in 1912 and 1949 when the rezoning took place. I do not know what it is. I have not had access to the records, but certainly for uniformity in zoning, I think all the greenhouse property should be rezoned comm- ercial all the vray back, all the way back into the other residential property. That is what Wm. Lindi~'s property is zoned as. There must be a mistake some place. The easiest way to correct this is simply to rezone the Wm. Lindig property and then have a planning engineer and a complete study made of all of the property remaining in Falcon Heights so that an error like this does not occur again and so vre get some proper planned zoning, in all of Falcon Heights, without any discrimination to one property owner and without any discrimination to any of the business men or. to any of the resi- dents. I think if you look at that map you will pause and wonder yourself as to what the equities are. You can pretty well take the Wm. Lindi property in one hand and you can take the residents on Fry and is whole area surrounding and then take all the other 11 n 1 greenhouses and you can see how the scales shift. Why should the .1177 Wm. Lindig property alone be zoned commercial all the way back? There is no sense to it, there is no reason to it, there is no need..- for it. In fact, the need is the other way around. It interferes with the residents in the residential A, zoning. It is discriminatory as far as the other greenhouse owners on Larpenteur are concerned. I don't think its fair to any of us or to any of them. We have gone as a group and tat ked to quite a number of the people who live in Falcon Heights. We have circulated a petition. This petition is not a petition where we stood on the corner and said in about one sentence, "dill you sign here? - Don't read it, but sign it." These petitions were explained to the residents. We have knocked on the doors. We have had the zoning maps with us, we have had the facts as they have been brought out to the olanning commission at the last two meetings. These facts have been patiently explained to people at each home. We did not have time to cover all of Falcon Heights obviously in the limited time we had, but we have talked seriously to all the people. We have explained something about some apartment buildings coming in. We have explained the tax loss resulting from apartments We have gone over the zoning map showing where a large tract of 435' depth was zoned commercial in the middle of a residential area without any conformity with any other property along Larpenteur, except where you get up to Snelling and Larpenteur - obviously the business district. There is no such depth as far as commercial zoning all the way along Larpenteur. We have explained the other greenhouse ordinances and that they are zoned primarily "Farmland". They were not given the same right as Wm. Lindig. We have patiently shown and explained what the meetings were about prior to this time. We have taken a lot of time at each place. These petitions were not signed blindly. The people read them and they were explained to them, and I would like to present to the Council these petitions signed by 675 voters and residents of Falcon Heights. This resolution simply says that the undersigned people wish to have the Wm. Lindig property rezoned to residential ~, except for the south 179' which should and must remain commercial to be uni- form along Larpenteur. However, Mr. Lindig is certainly entitled as a matter of right and a matter of law to his present non-confor w- ing use which is also stated in the petition. The resolution also recommends to the Council, and I know this is nothing new to the Council, I know that you have as a group talked about and are talk- ing about hiring a Planning Engineer to make a study of the zoning for Falcon Heights; not only as to classification but as to the restrictive covenants within these general classifications so that we as people and you as councilmen know that a drive-in or ballroom or something of that kind will not go in a certain place. You will determine what goes in each place, and the general make-up of the Village. You will also determine if an apartment building will go in a certain place and, if so, what the density is -- all of those restrictions. I appreciate, gentlemen of the Council, that this is nothing new to you - that you have discussed it and are currently . in the position of attempting to hire a planning engineer. You have discussed it many times in the last couple months and I do not want to leave the impression with you or the people of Falcon Heights that we are attempting to recommend something to the Council 117$ that is new to them, and this last paragraph of our resolution which recommends the hiring of a planning engineer and a new zoning ord- inance for the entire village with restrictive covenants within the general classifications of the rezoning ordinance. However, we thought the Council would appreciate receiving an expression of opinion from as many people as we could talk to and that was approximately 675 people. I don't think that I have a ~*reat deal more to say. We have all looked at the property; we have all studied it; we have all looked at the zoning ordinance and the Boning map of Falcon Heights. I think it is perfectly obvious that the Wm. Lindig property sort of stands up like a sore thumb on Larpenteur showing the commercial or business district zoning. We feel again that it is not fair or equitable or proper that the entire tract be zoned commercial because of the disadvantage, the safety, health and welfare of the neighboring community and area around the Wm. Lindig troperty. We think there is gross dis- crimination with other greenhouse owners along Larpenteur: The Killmers, the Art Lindi~;s, the Hermes and the Gibbs Nelson. We think they should all be treated alike. Rre think that is fair. R`e think that the Council and the people should recognize the danger of a commercial zoning on a residential street going deep into a residential area, and the problems in traffic, and safety and valuation and tax devaluation that will exist because of some projects that might go in there. We therefore ask the Council to rezone the 'Nm. Lindig property to residential A except for the south 179' subject, of course, to the present non-conforming use, and to hire a planning engineer to proceed with a complete study including the Wm. Lindig property, after rezoned, and all other greenhouse property along Larpenteur, and then come up with a def- inite recommendation for the planning commission and to you Council- men on the over-all planning for Falcon Hei~*hts. That's all I have to say- thank you very much. Rdembrez Mayor Nilsen called Mr. Lindig. 1~~Ir. George Membrez said he would like to speak on behalf of T,~Ir. Lindig because ~4r. Christenson, Attorney for Cdr. Lindig, who was to appear, got sick this after- noon. He said he was in full agreement with the petition for re- zoning when he (Korstad) asked why zone only the Wm. Lindig property back 135'. Why not zone the other. It would be very smart to zone the property all the way up Larpenteur to that ex- tent so you can actually make good provisions for developments along Larpenteur. You know very Vrell that a depth of 175' doesn't create enough land for good business to come in. As an example, we have Leaf & Thera's property across the street who I understand have an option now to put up an office building; and they find them- selves where they don't have enough space to park the automobiles; and I understand they have gotten an option on Tdr. Weight's home to give them sufficient parking space. That's what I am trying to im- press on you -- you must have enough space to handle a real good business and actually 179' is not sufficient to do it. Going back to the rezoning for Mr. Lindig, I am omewhat familiar with the details of that situation. Back in 19.6, A?r. Lindig came before the Rose Township 3oard to have his property zoned to a commercial classification. The prop- erty, of course, at the time was iar_•m residence and the reason that Mr. Lindig made the .request at the time was that he was hoping some day to be able to retail merchandise such as lawn mowers and many other things in connection vrith that type of business and he 1 1 1179 1 1 1 thought, back in 1917, that it would be a good idea to have it rezoned commercial for this reason. As far as I can remember, this was the first piece rezoned to a commercial classification. That was back in 1917. I may ask why wasn't that line followed all the way down east and west? I still believe it would have been smart to have done that and created a real business development all the way along Larpenteur Avenue, and the only reason the other greenhouse property to the west wasn't zoned was because the people didn't care to have it zoned. They never filed a petition for rezoning with the old Township Board or the Village of Falcon Heights up to this time. For the sake of good zonings I think this property should be zoned to the depth of Mr. Lindig's property all the way west of Lindig's. It is easy for us to talk about another man's property. A group of people here seem to think that Mr. Lindig's commercial zoning should be cut down to 179'. I have never agreed with the law - actually it's in the books and there isn't much you can do about it, but in my experience in this kind of work I have never agreed with the law that permits people to file a petition to rezone another man's property without his willingness to do so. It is unfortunate. Mr. Lindig is somewhat concerned. He has a piece of property there which is worth some money and if it is zoned resi- dential to within 179' north of Larpenteur Avenue, the people who are so concerned that their own property might depreciate in value if apartments were built on this site are not at all concerned about the depreciation of It'ir. Lindig's property. Rezoning this property to residential except for the south 179' would be a terrific loss to PJir. Lindig and that certainly deserves some con- sideration. Now Mr. Mayor and the Council, I don't know whether we can actually divorce the rezoning petition and the apartments, but I would like to speak about the land use for which this property was sold if I may. I do believe the reason this rezoning petition has come to your Council is because the Spiegler people requested a building permit. These people were not concerned about the classification of Mr. Lindig's property until the request from Spiegler for build- ing permits came in. Nilsen Excuse me, Mr. Membrez. Nodding to Korstad, "Do you have any ob- j ections?'~ Korstad I purposely tried to stay away from too much discussion of the apartment project. We would like to have an hour to an hour and a half to discuss the apartments, the plans and the rest of it. We would be glad to do it tonight but not in the limited time allowed for this meeting and certainly not while the petition for rezoning is up for consideration. It would take us at least an hour or an hour and a half to present all t•he material we have regarding the apartment project. We are prepared to go ahead to it and into it after the rezoning petition is acted on. We think, under these circumstances, the apartment project should not be gone into. We do not object to references here and there but it doesn't look like that is what is going to happen. Membrez I just want to make this thing clear. I have a few notes here. I am asking this: What possible harm can commercial property on Fry Street do to people on St. Mary's for instance? I just can't quite figure out what the ob~ec~~on is too Navin this o~~rtyfleft as is. I drove around here may Imes an I s:e ~he respirde s St. Mary's 1180 practically back of the restaurant, and there is a man who signed the petition who arparently is objecting to the apartment buildings and this petition was served because of it. He has an interest in some apartment buildings on Eustis and Larpenteur where the buildings are so close that if a man had a long arm, he could shake hands with the fellow in the next building every morning and say good morning, and the set back on these buildings is 8' fro~a Eustis and about 18' from Larpenteur. The same people who signed the petition to rezone Mr. Lindig's property are interested in that situation out there. It's a strange thing to me. I do believe it is unfair. Rezoning Mr. Lindig's property back to 179' would seriously devaluate his property. There is no question about it. After bringing the line to 179' from the south what is going to happen to the rest of the property from the home that is built on the north to the new line you are establishing? If its true that by virtue of having apartment buildings or any commercial use, if it's true, then Mr. Lindig certainly is losing the value of that property to the extent of 253 feet, isn't he. It s.;ems to me that bringing this line down to 253' is not going to help the situation at all. You will still have the same situa- tion and I maintain, that. as the expert testified at a former meeting here, that people who bought next to Mr. Lindig's property or across the street already depreciated his property at the time he bought 'zis home because the property to the west and to the south (Leaf & Thera's property) was already zoned commercial. Therefore there is no question in my own mind -- I happen to be an authorized appraiser for the F. H. ~.. myself but I am not €zoing to testify on that because I'm prejudiced. However, there is no question in my mind that when those people purchased their homes next to this commercial property, the depreciation had already taken place at that time. Therefore anything you do here certainly is not going to depreciate the property an4Y more than it is at this time. It makes sense. I can't quite understand why the folks here are so against having four beautiful apartment buildings, well landscaped and with a lot of beautiful trees and screening all around the place. I just can't understand and I hope you folks will reconsider. Thank you very much. Nilsen Mr. Lindig, do you wish to speak in your own behalf? 'PJm Lindig Well I think Mr. ~Iembrez has covered it pretty well. I still don't see why the people want to rezone this property on me. It has been that way since 1946 and I don't know why they got all these signa- tures. I understand its only within 500' one way or the other that it would mean anything anyway, The University Farm and the Farmer's Terminal are commercial and the few houses on Fry Street and I don't think they have enough signatures to do anything about it. I think if they want to rezone this on me, I'm entitled to some reimbursement from somebody - the village or the people who have their names on the petition if they want to take it away from me. The way I feel about it, these people just ti~~ant to steal from me. I don't see how they are going to be able to sleep nights. They knew it was commercial and. if they didn't, they had a perfect right to look it up, hadn't they? They all knew it. I don't understand why they want to do something now. I don't know what the people in the neighborhood are thinking of. 1181 Nilsen Mr. Korstad you submitted this resolution to the Council here. I wonder if you would mind reading the resolution, please. 1 Korstad Certainly, the Heading is Resolution: "Whereas, the present zoning ordinance of the Village of Falcon Heights, Minnesota, was adopted in 19l~9 at the time the Villa.~e of Falcon Heights was incorporated, and WHEREAS, at such time no complete overall study of zoning was- made for the Village but instead the zoning as prescribed by the Township in 1942 was adopted, and WHEREAS it now appears that because some of the Business District zoning is located in a 100% residential area and that such tracts have never been used for Business or Commercial purposes, and WHEREt~S, with the growth of the Village it becomes necessary to require restrictive zoning within the general zoning classification to protect the values, the beauty, the health, the safety, and the general welfare of the community, and WHEREAS, the Planning Commission of Falcon Heights has recommended to the Village Council of Falcon Heights that the action recommended by this Resolution be adopted. NOW THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that the Council of the Village of Falcon Heights change the zoning of the following described tract of land located in Ramsey County, State of Minnesota, From a Business District classification to a Resi- dence Distrie~ "~" classification: The Westerly 285 of lot 8 Annie L. Hendrickson's Acre lots, Ramsey County, Village of Falcon Heights, Minnesota, except- ing from said tract the following described parts: 1 (1) the north 850' of said tract (2) the west 60' of the south 195' of said tract; and (3) the south 1?9' of said tract lying easterly of the westerly 60' of said tract, subject to the present non-conforming use. BE IT FURTH~t RESOLVED, that the Village Council of Falcon Heights immediately conduct a complete study of the zoning of Falcon Heights, together with the necessity of restrictive zoning within the general zoning classifications and employ a Planning Engineer to assist in such study so that modern zoning requirements will be adopted commensurate with the growth and development of the commun- ity. lr`de the undersigned residents of the Village of Falcon Heights, Minnesota do hereby adopt the foregoing; resolution and recommend its adoption by the Village Council of Falcon Heights: 1 Nick Chris- Mr. Chairman, I would like to have him re-read that one line about tensen the Planning Commission. I would like to get that more clearly. Otis Vdhere did you get your information for that statement on the Planning Commission? Tdilsen Mr. Korstad, is it your intention that the resolution be read into the minutes? Korstad Yes, very definitely, we would like to have it submitted. Nilsen Then, I think its proper, of course, that the Members of the Planning Commission ask the questions that they have. Membrez fidhile he's looking for that, may I add another statement while 1182 we're waiting? Nilsen Yes. r:2embrez I neglected to go back to how ~t2r. Lindig's property was re- zoned. Back in 191~b, TQr. Lindig came before the rosetov~~nship asking for the rezoning of this property. At that time, ±.he Board of Supervisors submitted this request to the Ramsey County Planning Commission. This Commission is not very active today but they were very active those days. They have representatives from every township in Ramsey County, Village Engineers, County Auditor's Office and a representative from the City Engineer's Office. That petition was submitted to the Ramsey County Planning Commission. They, in turn, submitted it to the zoning committee which was a branch of the P~amsey County Planning Commission. The zoning committee made a survey of this property and they recomended to the Ramsey County Planning Commission that the property be rezoned to a commercial classifi- cation. At that meeting in Jamaary, 191.17, the Ramsey County Planning Commission accepted the report of the zoning committee and unanimously recommended to the Board of Supervisors of Rose . To~rmship tha± this property be zoned from farm residence to busi- ness. I -repeat again that. at that time this land was vacant here. Yse had no homes and as ?dr. Lindig mentioned a few moments ago anyone who bought property certainly should have made it their business to find out how the property was classified -- "rdr. Lin- dig's property and the property across the street and so forth. That's the story of the rezoning of Mr. Lindig's property. There seems to be some question as to why the property to the west was not similarly rezoned -- it was because the owners of the property were not interested in rezoning and didn't request rezoning. That's the thing in a nut shell. Thank you. very much. Korstad I wish to say that regardless of when or how fir. Wm. Lindi~;'s property was rezoned commercial, it still constitutes spot zoning; it still is discriminatory; it still is unfair to all the zoning; it still is improper to the uniformity of all the zoning along Larpenteur. It does not make any difference that the people did not come forth to object. I don't think we waive our rights as far as equity is concerned as to what would go in there. As soon as we found such a monstrosity as six huge apartment buildings might go in there, you bet we objected. Then we found out really what might happen. ~Te have already testified to the devaluation of the homes in the surrounding area and it certainly amounts to a Brea':, deal more than the devaluation of the 1~jm. Lindig property. I feel very sorry about this whole thing and I think everybody in our whole neighborhood does. It certainly is nothing personal with ~Ir. Lindig. It is too bad that the whole of Larpenteur was not zoned commercial X35 or l~31 feet all the way along all the way up to Eustis. Vice vrouldn't have to be here, but the point is it wasn't done. It was only done in one spot and in a residential area. That is why we are here. V4e wish we didn't have to come up here and ask for rezoning as far as the Lindigs are concerned. We feel very badly about it, but we do not feel that Wm. Lindig was entitled to have his property rezoned. It is not uniform with the zoning as far as Larpenteur Avenue is concerned and as far as the other greenhouses are concerned. It would not be fair to have one spot zoned that deep. Otis P~Sr. Chairman. 1183 Nilsen Mr. Korstad, there is an unanswered question. Korstad Well the Real Estate Man kept talking a.nd I had to listen to that. I can't read this while he's talking because I am expected to answer. I'm trying to find it now. Nilsen I see. Atty. My name is Tilton. I am a member of the law firm of Robins, Davis Tilton & Lyons representing the builders. Although it has been said many times that the question of the apartments was not directly involved, it is perfectly obvious by the comments made by the advocates of the rezoning of this property, that the apartments are, in fact, involved. I won't comment on the characterization of the apartments except to say that in the City of St. Paul, small investors have found that these apartments, rather than being monstrosities, are something that really beautify the neighborhood and are a real benefit to the neighborhood. I won't comment on the alleged devaluation of property except to say that I understand that at a previous meeting one of the most distinguished and best known appraisers in the Twin City Metropoli- tan Area was prepared to advise the body that the apartment project as developed, as projected, would not in fact devaluate the neigh- borhood -- it would, in fact, increase the value of the neighbor- hood. Rather than discuss the apartments as such, I would rather return to the immediate question before this group -- that is the Question of rezoning this piece of property. I was pleased to hear that the proponent of this petition felt that spot zoning was illegal. I was, however, dismayed to hear that in spite of his feeling that spot zoning was illegal, he proceeds to suggest that this Council do exactly that. The proceeding that you have in front of you is not unusual, In the City of St. Paul, and in other suburban areas, I am sure than when a Planning Board, when a legislative body is faced with an issue of granting a permit, a few owners become greatly concerned because they feel, either rightly or wrongly, that their awn pocket book will be hurt, and begin action for re- zoning the property. In the City of St. Paul, the Planning Board, the Board of Zoning and the City Council has long felt that this is an inappropriate time to begin rezoning the property out from under an owner, when he has made an advantageous sale of the property for a legitimate use which under the law can be made. If cuestions like this are to be raised, they should be raised at a time far in advance of the expenditure of money by the owner and the proposed developer on the proposed site. I also want to call your attention to one somewhat unusual provision of your particular law which permits this particular proceeding. I mean no criticism of it. fl~fy familiarity with other zoning laws requires that 5~ of the frontage to be rezoned must be a part of the petition. This prevents the kind of proceeding where only the piece of property being rezoned is the piece of property under attack. In other words, if you are going to have this type of adversary rezoning, you have to involve a piece of property at least the size of the piece of property you are attacking along with it, in order to rezone a man's land out from under him. I 1184 would like to suggest therefore that possibly the most in- telligent suggestion and the most worth while su~~;estion was the one I did hear about getting an expert planner in here. Gettin~- somebody who could really look over the whole situation in the Village a.s T have been advised this Council has seriously consid- ered from time to time. Apparently this is what the citizens desire and I want to add, on behalf of the proposed developer, we have full confidence in such a procedure As we look at it, as outsiders, and we can only speak as outsiders, at least at the moment as outsiders, we feel that to characterize the zoning as set forth in the original ordinance which I assume is accurate, I am looking at a photostatic copy, dated the 11th of Octobdr, 1949, as far as any uniform length upon Larpenteur is to take such a small sample as to make it impossible to make any generalization. It appears you have one side of the street from Pascal to Snelling zoned commercial on the north side and on the south side. The block from Arona to Snelling is about 3~4 commercial. On the north side, that is the side where we are standing, it appears that from 200 to 300 feet is commercial and on the sodth side it appears to be cut up. ~,t Snelling, its one distance, back its a smaller distance and then across the street over here, the property under consideration, it is a larger dis- tance. The point I am making is that it hardly seems possible to discuss this issue in terms of there having been a continuous strip and suddenly a break in it when what we are talking about is 3 or 4 blocks and the exceptions are just about as lame a percentage of the zoningof business as the strip is. In any event, it does appear that since this Village existed this property has been listed in this fashion and it further appears that the advocate for rezoning this property out from under the owner agrees whole-heartedly that spot zoning, spot rezoning, is, in his opinion, illegal, if not immoral, and to a certain extent unethical, that is, it is to a certain extent to a ~~reat number of people a breach of the moral contract between individuals, between man and his fellow man, to spot rezone a piece of property and he has made the statement in addition that he believes it is illegal, and under these conditions, I believe that if the council is seriously concerned, and I feel sure they are seriously concerned about the problem presented by this piece of property, that this matter do be referred to a competent expert because we feel that without the passion of people being concerned with an apartment project which they wrongfully consider will injure their pocketbook, we can sit down across a table and point out why this is a beneficial project and why this piece of property should in fact be commercial for the benefit of the entire community, for all the residents of the community in terms of their entire structure taxwise and other- wise. Thank you. Nilsen P.4r. Korsta.d, have you anything to say? You had a question P~4r. Christensen? Is h7r. Christensen there? Any qu_stion? Otis I guess it was my question, i+~r. Mayor. I asked where they got the information about the Pla i C i -i ' nn ng omm s.. on s recommendations. Pdilsen ti~Tas your qu~;stion satisfactorily answered? Otis No, it wwas not. 1185 Nilsen Mr. Korstad? Korstad I showed him wheNe I ~;ot it and he said apparently the planning commission revoked +uhat ruling and I have not received a copy or been so informed. If that is the case, then I apologize to the Planning Commission. I don't get copies of everything. I request what I happen to hear about, and if they are mis-interpreted, why that's a mistake; it's too bad; and I apologize for it; but I don't think I have to go through a cross examination. Whatever the Planning Commission did, I think they should get up and tell about it. This is a public forum. Nilsen Thank you. Owens I would like to ask a question. The paragraph in question reads as follows: "Whereas the Planning Commission of Falcon Heights has recommended to the Village Council of Falcon Heights that the action by this Resolution be adopted." I would like to ask P~?r. Otis was or has the Planning Commission ever made that recommenda- tion? Otis Not to my knowledge. I don't think you will find anything of that sort in the letters turned in to the Council. Ovrens I'm only calling on memory, I don't have documents, but the first night we were here talking about this apartment dwelling and the Wm. Lindig property, the Chairman of -the Planning Commission, or a gentleman who represented the Planning Commission, suggested out loud here that a rezoning study be conducted and as I recall, some gentleman who was in the business of rezoning made the verbal recommendation that this kind of resolution be considered. Can't we look here at your Iviinutes to pick up this information? Otis I don't recall any Planning Commission recommendation that this be rezoned class A residential, and that is the objection that I am making here because the petition that went out is an implication that the Planning Commission recommended that the Bill Lindig prop- erty be rezoned to Class A residential. PZilsen We want to clarify this, Pis. Korstad, because you asked that the resolution be recorded in the Tinutes and I think that the fact that you say there are approximately 675 signatures there, that even though there may be a misunderstanding, that we do something to clarify it. With that in mind, we will briefly go over these things. Korstad Is Mr. Hasbrouck here? The gentleman who made the recommendation for the Planning Commission, or to or for the Planning Commission? He appeared at the Planning Commission meeting and I think at the Council, didn't he? Nilsen Yes. Korstad He appeared to make that recommendation. We were led to believe that that was what the Planning Commission recommended. Obviously, you know what you did. We are not trying to ±ell you what you did. We do know It7r. Hasbrouck did make a recommendation, I talked to him personally and he told me so. We did not want to mis-quote you. That's all I know. I am familiar with the Hasbrouck report. PLANNING REPORT BY SHERMAN 1186 S. HASBROUCK, 2~9~59 1. General Land Use. There would be nothing., wrong with the use of this area for multiple dwellings, provided the development were to be designed in away that would protect the adjacent res- idential neighborhood. However, there should be either a garden apartment development covering the whole area or limited commer- cial use adjacent to Larpenteur with the north part devoted to single or two-family residences. 2. 102 units are proposed for 2.6l~ acres. This is about 1,100 sq. ft. of lot area per dwelling unit. Minimum zoning require- ments in the suburbs I am working with range from 2,800 sq. ft. to 3,300 sq. ft. In other words, the density of this proposed development is from two to three times too high. 3. Floor area. Satisfactory. ~. Off-street parking. One space per unit is provided. However the spaces are a trifle small - 9 x 20 instead of 10 x 20, which is a minimum. Also ti^tith the long term trend in car use„ expansion space should be provided for an additional 1~2 space per dwelling unit. 5. Screening. The plan shows no screening where the development is adjacent to a single family residential area. 6. Set Back. The 30' set back along' Fry should be increased to ~5 or 50 feet. The buildings within the development are much too close to one another (areflection of the excessive density). 7. Building Design. Considering the quality of the homes in the immediate area, the design does not seem compatible with the neighborhood. Lower structurE;s would seem more appropriate, for example. 8. Site Design. There is a lack of adequate recreation area and improper handling of traffic. The site plan would result in con- siderable traffic encroachment upon surrounding; homes. Recommendation: Denial of the proposed multiple dwelling develop- ment on the grounds that. it fails to meet minimum planning standards. PRE,ZIIt~INARY RECOr~~VI~IDA.TTON FOR GEDERAL AREA: 1. The zoning ordinance should be amended to include a "Limited Business" category. (clinics, office buildings, apartments, rest- homes, etc.) 2. The south part of this property - and probably the area to the east - should be placed in this new business zone. 3. The north part of the property should be rezoned to single family residence, but with multiple dwellings permitted by special use permit. Signed: Sherman S. Hasbrouck, Planning Consultant. Now on February 11th, the Planning; Commission made the following recommendation to. the Village Council: 1187 That the Council refuse to grant the building permit as being con- trary to the best interests of the village. It appears that the proposed construction would affect adversely public health, safety and welfare. The following considerations influenced the Planning Commission Decisions 1. The attached report by Sherman Hasbrouck a professional city planner. 2. Increased traffic in the area. 3. Buildings not in conformity with the other buildings in the area. ~.. Inadequate water supply. If City Water is used, it may deprive existing homes of water. If wells are used, it may lower the water level. 5. Effects on adjoining property values -- would cause a drop of 10 to 15~ in values within a 500' radius. 6. Large numbers of families and many children with no play area. 7. The concentration of so many families in a small area will eventually result in a blight area which will affect public health and welfare. 8. Informal petition from affected neighbors, Si®ned by David Cartwright, the acting chairman of the Planning Comm. Nilsen Naw that brings us up to the latest action of the Planning Connnissian, and I have a letter from the Secretary of the Planning Commission, Air. Otis. For your information, all matters pertaining to zoning and rezoning are referred to the Planning Commission. Here is their letter of April 2nd addressed to the Mayor: "In response to your request for the Planning Commission's recommenda- tions in regard to the request for rezoning a portion of the William Lindig property, and a new plan for an apartment development for this area, the Planning Commission has met. After considerable dis- cussion of these proposals, the following recommendations were unan- imously approved: 1. That the petition for rezoning be held in abeyance and that no building permit be issued to the Spiegler Construction Company for the apartment development until the entire village is studied from a planning standpoint with recommendations, by a competent planning consultant for use of village land now subject to further develop- ment and the proper zoning regulations that will assure that use. 2. That a competent planning consultant be retained to work with the planning commission to complete such a study and make recommenda- tions for best use of remaining land and a suitable zoning ordinance. The petition for rezoning is being returned herewith." Signed by C. K. Otis, Secy., Falcon Heights Planning Commission. Nilsen Any other comments? Otis Well there was one other implication in there that wasn't very compli- 1 mentary to the Planning Commission and that was that the Village hadn't been studied for possible rezoning and so on, and that is contrary to the fact. We have been working on that from time to time. We have always, of course, met with difficulties because of the fact that no one wants to make changes that will affect their property. Not as the Planning Commission, but personally, it seems to me that in view of the facts we have been working arith for years someone had a rare sense of the fu+..ure when they set that back to 180' or so. Our business district here in our main business area is lacking in parking space and we are con- tinually confronted with the fact that people cannot get in there for their shopping. There is always a traffic tangle and there is always a very bad situation. It is unsafe actually to park your car on the East side of Snelling. People are coming in from one direction and t'^e other. Vie have been working on that problem. We haven't come up with anything, but there is an intersection now coming into the picture that, is apt to change our whole situation here and that is one of the reasons we feel we '~, feel we should get the help of this planning expert to work out some scheme for the balance of the vacant land. Nilsen I think everyone here will apprecia±e the reason for going into this matter for a moment or two. When a resolution is presented to the Village Council bearing 675 signatures, represen tinp~ a cross section of the people of the Village of Falcon Hei~~hts, then I feel it is important to establish v~;hat is on that resolution. I feel very strongly about that. I am not wishing to take excep- tion or anything like that. I merely wish to clarify the official record of the T~2inutes of the Council of Falcon Heights on this particular matter. With respect to the submission of this resolution which we have been asked to incorporate in the records of the Village of Falcon Heights this particular evening, T don't think that anyone will take exception to our action in asking that this be done. I don't think anyone can do that. Mis-understanding or no mis-understard- ing, it is an official record that must be set straight. Tdow I would like to, as a matter of the record, and. supplementing the Planning Commission's work, ask the clerk to read into the record a letter from ;~Sr.. C. B. Loecks who is now Chairman of the ~~etropolitan Planning Commission, with reference to work that was done in the Village of Falcon Heigh±.s previously. I think his testimony bears some merit and should be accdpted into the records this evening. Utecht Utecht read the following letter dated December 3rd, 1954, addressed to Mr. Lorris Williams. Chairman Falcon Heights Planning Commission, 1784 Simpson, Falcon Heights, Minnesota: "Dear Mr. Williams: ~n November 11th you requ-~sted the opinion of tY~e under- signed as to the policy which Falcon Hei~;hts should follovr with reference to additional zoning in the Village. Attached is a report summarizing the results of a preliminary study of the matter to- gether with a map illustrating the basis for my conclusions. Al- though I do not believe further research is justified at tY~is time, I would be happy to meet with your people to discuss the matter further if such a meting is desired." Si€ned C. D. Loecks, TiEUIORA.nIDUT,7 dated December 3rd, 1954. Suggested policy relative to additional commercial zoning for the Village of Falcon Heights, T,2innesota. 1189 1. PURPOSE AND SCOPE.On November Ilth, Adr. Lorris VTilliams, Chairman of the Planning Commission of the Village of Falcon Heights, requEa ted that the undersigned provide advice concerning the most appropriate course which the Village should follow with reference to the provision of additional commercial zoning. Assuming that commercial zoning adequateto meet the needs of the community is desirable both from the standpoint of convenience and tax policy, the issue can be simply expressed by two questions: 1. Should the Village zone additional Land for commercial purposes now in anticipation of fut,u.re development? 2. Or, should the community adopt a "wait and see" policy, review each proposal on its merits when it is presented and take such ac- tion as the particular situation warrants? The area which was selected for specific study consists of the land adjacent to Larpenteur west of Snelling. The comments which follow are limited in their application to this district. 2. DISCUSSION. ildith reference to question 1) above, an analysis of the exhibit accompanying this report entitled "Land Use and Zoning, Portion of Falcon Heip~hts, Minresota,'~ reveals the following date with reference to the portion of the study area located adjacent to Larpenteur between Cleveland and Snelling. TABLE 1 ANALYSIS BY USE Larpenteur between Cleveland and Snelling TOTAL PUBLIC PRIVATE PRIVATE Private, Vacant Vacant zoned for zoned for Res. or Agr. Commercial. Feet 18160 6175 9995 1570 l~60 Percent look 50.9 19.1% 15.45 4.52 Of the roughly 1570 feet of frontage which is vacant, residentially zoned and in private ownership, that attached display shows that most of it is divided into small parcels of 100 to 200 feet in width and, consequently, not particularly usable for consolidated commercial functions i~h its present form. Therefore it can be concluded that at present there is very little space, within the study area, presently zoned for residence or agriculture which is, by its size or location, inherently commercial in character. It is the experience of the under- signed that zonings areas of the kind under discussion in anticipation of commercial development does not, in itself, operate to reserve the land for this use. The reader need look no farther than the apartment buildings constructed adjacent to the northeast corner of Idaho and Snelling for verification of this statement inasmuch as the land upon which the apartment buildings are situated is classified for commer- cial purposes. St. Paul has many similar areas. On the other hand, if land of the kind under discussion zoned for commercial purposes is at a later date partially developed for resi- dential uses, positive hafm can result. Subsequent commercial developments on the remaining vacant land which are incompatible with the dominant residential character of the area, can only lead to con- flicts between the commercial an dresidential interests. 1190 With reference to question 2), it is the opinion of the under- signed that a "wait and see~~ policy will, in the long; run, prove to be in the best interest of the community. If, for example, a developer should assemble within one ownership a piece of land-of sufficient size to provide a proposition that is desirable and -- attractive from the standpoint of the community, there is nothing to prevent the Council from re-classifying land at that time. The advantage of this approach is that the specific proposition can be reviewed carefully and conditions attached to the reclassifi- cation which would minimize any adverse effects which the facility might possibly have on the free movement of traffic or the enjoy- ment of adjacent land ownership. It is noted, for example, that the Falcon Heights Zoning Ordinance makes no provision for the requirement of off-street parking and loading space. Presumably, questions of this kind could be reviewed at the time the Council considers the proposed Zoning change. 3. CONCLUSION. In view of the numerous shopping centers which are under construction or planned in this district, it is doubtful whether the property west of Snelling along Larpenteur, presently zoned for agriculture and residence, will ever become particularly competitive for community shopping purposes. In view of the fact that there is very little vacant land in pri- vate ownership which is presently classified for residence or agri- culture that is of such shape or size as to make it inherently suitable for commercial activities of the kind which would operate to the benefit of the community, and in view of the fact that the classification of this land for commercial purposes at this time would not necessarily reserve the land for this use but might, at a later date, actually result in a harmful situation due to mixed land uses, it is recommended that the Village wait until addition- al information is developed as to the kinds of commercial uses which could be established in the area under consideration-.for commercial purposes. Signed C. D. Loecks. Nilsen I think we simply want to bring out this point. There are some im- plications in this resolution that no studies have been made by the Planning Commission. It is obvious that there was some mis-informa- ation with respect to that and, as a matter of fact, C. B. Loecks was consulted in 195 in respect to this, Is there anyone else who wishes to speak at this particular time? Julen My name is Don Julen and I am representing the owners of the shopping center on the corner of Larpenteur and Snelling. I want to make it clear tha+„ I don't represent the business men. The business men would rather not be in the middle of a thing like this. I want to point out that we in this shopping; area are becoming quite pinched for other things than parking. As it has been pointed out, our parking is bad. We know it. I would like to see this property developed not so much in a commercial way, as it is now zoned, but I do feel that the apartment project as presented some time ago was right. The tax structure is such that we need more taxes. 02_ar bus- iness on this corner is such that we need more people. The only way we can do that is by inviting developers to come in and build pro- jects that will bring more people in and keep our business area a success. The more shopping areas that are built around. us gradually eat into our business and I'm here, I want to fight for that busi- ness for our area. I think we need it. I came armed with a lot of information about the apartments, but if that's taboo, I would rather 1191 not bring it up. Thank you very much. Owen My name is William Owen. I live at 17?.8 St. i~iary's Avenue. Mr. Jul~n, I thank you for bringing up the matter of taxes. I am a tax payer and I see around me a lot of happy tax paying faces living in our village. I have very recently had the pleasure of looking into my own personal tax situation. I don't know if I want it made a matter of public record. In 1956, payable 1957 , my taxes were ~555.1~7. Like all good citizens, I expected to pay more money for the things that are built and added to our community, like schools and roads and so forth so I wasn't really upset in 1957 when I paid my taxes, For 1957, they were ~61t~.38 - an increase of X58.01 which was related to a 16 or 17% mill increase in our county and community. In talking; to tho peole in the community I found that they hadn't received their 1958 tax statements. I had. In this particular year, I shall have the rrivilege of paying $113.80 add- itional. My taxes have ~7one up from ~61i~,38 in 1957 to X727,28. This, as I mentioned, represents an increase of X113.80 and in two years X171.81 -- a 31~ increase in taxes in tyro years. I'm not happy about that. It's too darned much money. Now I can't do any- thing about that except urge you people to urge your neighbors and the fellows we vote for to spend a little less money. I don't know the exact figures about apartment house dwellings, but I did see the estimated cost of educating 70 children as being 33 thousand dollars and, a±. our current millape rate, the taxation from the proposed apartment somewhere in the neighborhood of lb thousand dollars. I am not a mathematical genius, but 17 thousand dollars paid out of pocket seems to me to be adding to my tax picture rather than subtracting from it. Now I don't want to vouch for these figures because I didn't do the figuring and don't want to be attacked _for a variance. In talking with city and county officials in Hennepin .and Ramsey Counties, they came up with a statement - they would rather not be quoted because they ti~rant to be voted - but they did say Falcon Heights should en- courage industries and businesses which will give tax relief without creating additional educational tax liabilities. It doesn't take much reasoning to apply what I told you about my property to your own. Now I knoVr that the Village Officials are as interested as I am in keeping taxes at a minimum. I ~~ouldn't errant to imply in any way, shape or form, by word or gesture, or facial expression that I thought they had anything but our best interests at heart, because, gentlemen, I'm sure you do. I know you do, but as I went through our village I found one devil of a lot of people who are concerned about taxes. In fact, one gentler~an greeted me vrith the remark "If you have anything about taxes you want to talk about, Buster, you've come to the right man. Let me get up and see what I've got to say. Now we can sit here fat and happy and dream that these apartment houses will produce more income, but it simply aint so and I think you folks should consider it very carefully before you make decisions. Our committee has recommended to the Village Council that they to it easy -- not hurry into this. I think that~s all any of us vrant. V~fe are all interested in a wise decision and we don't think a hurried decision would be fair to Mr. Lindig or to us. We all respect Mr. Lindig's position -- natura3:ly he would like to have a good return on his property and we would like to have it so too; but, dad rat it folks, we don't i~ran t more taxes by carelessly conceived repres~nta- tions about new construction. Thank you. 1192 Nilsen Is there anyone else who wishes to speak? Mrs. MY name is P,4rs. Kittleson and I live at 1718 Fry. There has been Kittleson a lot of talk that we knew at the time that this was commercial, and the property being devaluated at the time, but when you buy a house and there is a house next door to you, you assume that it is zoned residential. Nobody checks all the lots around them. You assume that the existing land use is the way it is zoned. In other words, if there is a house next door, you assume that if they ever sold those houses, it tivould have to remain residen- tial area. lisle saw a greenhouse and farmland across from us and naturally i^re assumed it was zoned for greenhouses and farmland. Vde had no objection to this. Vve don't mind living across from farming land. So the fact that we didn't look into it to see whether it was commercial perhaps was our fault, but as I say I think everybody assumes land is zoned the way it is being used at the present time, and if we need an excuse for not looking into it, I guess that's about all we have Nilsen Is there anyone else who wishes to speak? :!drs. John I'm Mrs. John Kelsey, 1L~70 W. California. What I wanted to do Kelsey is ask some questions if I may. I wonder how -effective a petition would be where they went through the neighborhood and obtained 675 names, Some gentleman mentioned that only people within 500 feet were affected as far as the petition went. I would like to know what the people who are petitioning that this property be rezoned residential think should be put on that piece of property. Will people come in and build up against commercial property: Is that what they vrant the property for? I would like to know the purpose of rezoning to residential. Nilsen Mr. Graham? Graham In answer to the first question (I won't attempt to answer the second one), we are asked about the affect of this petition. It actually has no legal affect whatsoever. It is not one required by law or contemplated by law. I think it has been submitted for what weight, what value, and for what evidence the Council wishes to put it. I think the questions that have been directed to it and to the statements in the petition have been directed to whether or not the statements in the petition are accurate. The Council has been taking evidence. This is po:;sibly a piece of evidence relating to the feeling of the people who signed it. The Council will determine what weight it will be given. The Council is the body which will determine whether or not this property is to be rezoned. Now, with respect to the possible other use of the Lindig property, I will have to refer that to someone who can speak for the group that asked for rezoning. Does that answer your question on the first part? Kelsey Yes. Nilsen Do you wish to answer that at all, Mr, Korstad? Do you have any replies you wish to make to that, particular question? Korstad What was the question? Kelsey I want to know why you want s.o many f~;et rezoned residential. Do you feel, you people up against commercial property now, who have 1193 bought not knovring you were against commercial property, assuming that it was farm land, will anyone come in within a couple hun- dred feet of Mr. Lindig's and buy it as residential? You are go- ing to have another strip again right up against commercial prop- erty. What is to happen to that property of Mr. Lindig's? Korstad I think in my opening remarks I answered it as to why we think the present zoning is unfair, and that's all I would be able to say at this time. Nilsen Are there any citizens of Falcon Heights who wish to be heard re- garding this matter? Rev. E. R. Rev. E. R. Klein, 1710 Fry. The statement was made by a representa- Klein five of Mr. Lindig that the value of the property had been deflated at the time the individuals made purchase. I can testify that that statement is untrue because the property which is for sale was not devaluated at that time, and any loss in value would be say subse- quent to purchasing or at the time that any such project as has been proposed would be constructed on~the area across from it. Nilsen A lady raised her hand back there. WZrs. Herbert I am rdrs. Herbert Horton, 1It68 California and I merely want to Horton suggest that the council honor Mr. Lindig's rights, that they will not rezone it from commercial, and if people who are really objecting to commercial property are concerned that they buy that strip and donate it to the city and thus eliminate Mr. Lindig's loss and pay him what it is worth as commercial property and then retain the property for a. pleasanter use - whatever they feel is right for it. Nilsen Are there any other citizens of Falcon Heights who vrish to be heard, any property owner, any resident who wishes to be heard with respect to this? Does any citizen have a question they wish to ask? Klein Why would anyone refuse the buy the property if it was rezoned res- idential? fl4r. Kulkay right next door to our property purchased and built on his property .with the full knowledge tna+ the 179' on Larpenteur had been zoned. commercial. If he did so without any fear, I am sure that anyone who knew the property directly across from him vrould be available for residential property would have as much faith as he. Utecht I vrould like to ask a question of Mr. Korstad with the understanding that if he doesn't want to answer it, he is pef'fectly free not to. Presuming for a minute that the property were not rezoned, but left as it now is, is there any type of commercial operation that would be satisfactory to the people in your community? Korstad I'd be very glad to answer that, Ivlr. Utecht. We think because of the tax picture, because of the traffic problem, because of the cost of keeping up the roads, because of the water problem, that apartment buildings and buildings of that type are not proper on that property. We would be very happy to leave the property like it is and have a nice office building like GTA or some similar project that ill i w g ve something to the community in tax money and not take tax money away; and not present a traffic and safety problem and a playground problem to our children. We would very much like to have some commercial building of that, type, not by way of limitation, I say an office 119~t ~ , building would be perfect as far as we are concerned. Some of the developments on Snelling and Larpenteur are very good_ They do produce tax to the village. In other words, a super mar- ket, a clinic. I could think of many things that would be advan- tageous to the village from a tax viewpoint and still not present the problems of playgrounds, parking, traffic on Fry, the water problem and all the things we have gone into. I think there are many of them. I think the only way the Council can control that and have some- thing in there that is good for our Village is to rezone that property as tk~e petition on record asks; and then if and wYlen a good project comes in, in the opinion of the Council, then they obviously have the power to again rezone. In +.his way, the Council has some control and something to say in the absence of all these detailed ordinances we haven't got yet, which are in the mill and we will get them. This way you have a great deal more to say as to hat goes in there and certainly you have the right and can and we would recommend that you rezone the property again if one of those good projects come in. Z"Jm. Olsen Regarding the cost of educating 70 children offsetting our revenue, maybe some of the people who have studied this problem could answer the ruestion in my mind. I figure the cost per child is derived by dividing the total cost, by the number of children going to school. Assuming that another 70 were added to the school dis- trict, this won't be the only 70 the~~seville is building up, it doesn't mean t;'"ey are going to build another school just for those 70 children. The way I look at it - simple reduction - it would mean a reduction in the cost per child. Some woman said "'That's not true." Olsen said "Buell, it's not true the other way ei±her." The woman said !'Yes, it is, we've got facts." Olsen said "I'd like to have that answered so i could char it up in my mind.'" Korstad said I couldn't hear the last part of the statement you made - I would like to answer it. Olsen: Biell, I think from what has been stated here all along, that adding 70 ch~_Idren is going to multiply the present cost per child by another 70. I don't think that's probably true. It just doesn't make sense to me. Yorstad Bde discussed this with Supt. ~I;illiams and he had given us ±h ese figures- that the cost per pupil in 1958 was ~~09,G0. Add to that the capital retirement of X57.00 and these are his figures, a total of ~t~75.00 per child. I don't know whether you want to take the debt retirement or not. I figure that's a matter of opinion. Four hundred and nine dollars times 70 ch~_ldren is approximately 28 thousand dollars. The figures we quoted here were given to us by Supt. tiVilliams. Olsen Did B~iilliams say that adding 70 children would increase the expense 70 times that figure? That's the thing that doesn't make sense to me. ~Tou've probably got the right picture, but I just don't see it. Nilsen I don't think we'll be able to resolve that tonight. 'atie don't want to take up too much time with that particular phase of this testi- mony. Olsen I'll let Mr. Korstad's answer be sufficient. I think he knows what he is talking about. 1195 Otis I'm not coming out in favor of apartments, but I think it has been shown that if these people move across the line into P~oseville, it will cost us just as much. Nilsen Does anyone on the cour_cil have a question they wish to ask a_t:thbs particular time? Is there any informa tion you may want to seek? Is there any citizen of Falcon Heights who has anything further he wishes to add this evening? Arty residdnt? Anyone who appears on the petition? Is there anyone who wants to add anything to the testimony v~re have presently. Atty. Unfortunately, at the time I spoke a few minutes ago, the question of Tilton apartmen is was not before the house. It now appears that the pro- ponents of the rezong state quite clearly that the purpose of the rezoning is for the purpose of opposing the apartments. They rec- ognize that leaving a small strip of commercial would be just a guise, sort of a bone to the owner, and that they recognize arty commercial project, be it at this time or some Future time, would require at least the full amount of land the owner has zoned commercial, so in view of that recognition and in view of their statement that they would want to again rezone this property commercial, from which they are taking away the commercial status, when the right kind of project came in, I think we have nothing left to discuss but our apartment building. First of all I want to point out that the present plans call for four buildings comprising 68 units -- 17 units each. tie have attempted to comply with every single requirement put down in the PJilsen Do you have an objection, I~4r. Korstad? horstad- - Yes, we object on the same basis as we did before. If we wanted to open this up into apartment buildings, our whole presentation would be changed. Tilton With reference to rezoning, the question is relevant insofar as we have the type of development that this village should look for on this property. I certainly, representing a vested interest, rep- resenting a man who wants to build these apartments, a man who has built many apartment houses in the area, I am not going to tell you people here what is in your own best interests. I do know that ~Zr. Loecks has been an expert planner for many years and I was very in- terested in the report that he made in which he pointed out that you are not going to have shopping centers up and down Larpenteur Avenue. As a matter of fact, you a;~e ~ oing to have to have something to support these shopping centers because this is the basis of your hard, cold, tax base. That strip of shopping cen ters over there and the people who shop there that give that tax dollar some reality. I would like to point out that in an apartment type development, the statistics will show that there are 2.7 people per unit -- that's people not children, and a half child ner unit is somewhere around 35 children. I would also like to point out that these people will shop and. spend their dollars in this very area. I~4ore important than that, I think we about this man's rising taxes. This just about all of us no matter which to face the rising tax problem on ou villages around you, of much Brea+.er ments in the same school district. can't avoid the very question is a real problem confronting community we live in. We have r home, and the fact that the size, are putting these develop- I don't know for sure if my figures are accurate. If they are, I 1196 understand that out of the total millage of 197. mills, 117 are for the school district of which your village constitutes only a very small part. PJhether this project goes in here or does not go in here, the tax picture will remain the same. The peole who live in these apartments, whether in your village or not, are going to drive on your streets, require police protection, and they are going to attend your schools. You have an opportunity to have an impact on your village taxes - I notice they are a remarkably small percentage of your total taxes, but approximately 15~, or a millage levy, according to my figures if they are right, and I hope they are, of about 29 mills. I don't know how your assessor would asses this building, but on the basis of the guesses I made, and I would be happy to go over these figures with this gentleman, and the members of the council, on the basis of the other proposed building that we had, I estimated that there would be a reduction from 29 mills -- I estimated that there would be a drop of somewhere between 1 and 2 mills in the Village taxes and how this would. be offset by the rise in the school district taxes, I don't know. I don't know the size of the school district, but how one parti- cular project in this village might affect the school district as a whole, that is the extent of it, but I can say this - the problem cannot be viewed as this project in this area alone when you take into consideration that these builders could go out across the line tomorrow and build a nroject~that would have the same effect on your taxes; and if you are going to get the tax dollar in here to have any effect on your village taxes, you might as Trrell get the village share of it. In addition, you might as well get the dollars running into your shopping center so you have a justifiable base for your assessor to boost that up. Notiv the gentlemen owning it won't like it,but when those tills are ringing in there, that is how you estimate the value of that kind of property. He knows it and he would rather pay the taxes with those tills ringing; because there are people buying in there. You can't simply say it would be nice if we could have an office- type building or if we could have a nice, light-type industry Vrithout any smoke. That's what every village wants and its a lovely thing to get but you don't have one thing without the other. I think, if I can presume to suggest, in line wit':: P,Zr. Loecks think- ing, and he has been in this field a lot longer than I have and I assume than most of us, that it is precisely when a thing like this comes up, that you have to look at the whole picture. Not out of rose tinted glasses, but out of the realities that we all face. If you do this, I think you will find that. the revised plan is an appropriate thing for this village and in the best interests of the village, and I say again that although I don't represent the owners of the property, that it appears the rezoning petition is only for the purpose of defea±.ing this one project and that they want to rezone it back again if they Sind a buyer who is most acceptable, ^ apparently, than our clients. Thank you very much. Nilsen r.2r. Korstad Korstad Just one more word. and very short. P:e have so little property lef t in Falcon Heigh is that could be used for commercial purposes that I 1197 1 1 1 think we have to be pretty careful, and go pretty slow, and have some very ~•ood sta~dies as to what we should do with our land. Once its gone, its gone. There is so very little property left upon which tax revenue can be obtained ±hat its a pretty serious problem to get a project like this that cannot produce tax revenue for us. A4y answer to the previous gentleman who said if they don't build. here, they will build in Roseville anyway, is what they do in Roseville has nothing to do with us and vice versa. I think one is going; up there anyway no matter what happens here but our property in Falcon Heights that can be used for commercial purposes is very limited and we have to be pretty careful of what goes in on this property. It is a pretty serious problem for all of us from a tax revenue point of view. Nilsen Is there anyone who tiwishes to be heard? Anyone else? T:~embrez Just one remark. I think its pretty easy for anyone to say what should be done vrith another man's -property. Owen For the record, the village millage is 33.49 mills, and our total non-homestead is 20).x.97 mills. The homestead is 198.Z~.5 mills. Ulre pay to the state and general state mil~.age about 103 mills - a little better than that. If we get a reduction, it is not going to hurt us or help us the way you described it. It gets to be pretty small against 20L~.97 mills. If you ~~re interested in Roseville, I think it is a nice place to build. Tray I ask you if you were refused a project in Roseville? Tilton No, the question of Roseville has not, come up except that it hap*~ens to be in +he same school district. O~~ren a~rell this is only a rumor, but one of our, and it's bad to repeat those things, but I vrou]_d like to have it investigated. Tilton ti~Jell, it's not so that my clients have ever applied for a building rermit in P~oseville and been turned down. ~J;hatever the rumor is, it's not so. Spiegler It's viscious slander. T~lilsen Did you say 33. mills? OGVen 33.49 Tdilsen It should be 30.03 if I read this correctly. Am I correct, T;sir. Graham? Oianen b',ell, if it is so, it has been adjusted since day before yesterday. Tuilsen I've got the official ta.x statement here. Owen Very well, sir. I recEer you then to the credit record at the County Assessor's office because the gentleman gave Nilsen I wonder if you included the schools and library on there - that could have some bearing. Owen He had total mill age 33.49 Nilsen That's r~~-ht. You are including the school and library which is 3.46 mills. I just wanted to make that correction because this is the 1198 official mill levy here, ~'ou don't mind? Owen b`Je do mind, of course. (Joke} Laughter. Nilsen Is there anyone else who has some questions at the present time? Any further statements to add. to the testimony we have been gatherin~!.this evening? Well it is my recommendation at this time and I will so move tha+ this hearing be continued. I will ask the Village Attorney to state the proper resolution for that for me if he will. Graham Proceed with the he~~ring. Plilsen The Planning Commission has recommended that the petition for ~~e- zoning be held in abeyance and I rove that the Village Council meet on Tuesday, April 111th, jointly with the Planning Commission to hear this matter further with respect to the proposal of the planning consultant Vrho will be asked to make his presen Cation to the Council and the Village Planning Commission regarding his recommendations It was moved by Nilsen, seconded by Utecht and unanimously voted. to continue the hearing until 7 P. M. Thursday, April 23rd. Nilsen moved that the Village Council call a special meeting at 7:30 P. ~.2. on Tuesday, April 11_~th, with the Planning Commission regarding recommendations from a Profdssional Planner. Seconded by Utecht and unanimously carried. Fire Dept. The Deputy Clerk was instructed to write Roseville pointing out that P~dutual Aid at the time we sent them a resolution on this matter, it was returned to us with the request that we include the clause "At no charge", and asking that they include tie '"NoCharge" clause in their reso- lution. Assistant Due to the illness of 1"arm. Carroll, our present assessor, it vvas Assessor. moved by Shavor that we recommend the appointment of Alan C. Kline, 11132 UV. Idaho, as Assistant Assessor for the Village of Falcon Heights for the balance of 1959. Seconded by Utecht and unanimously carried. W. Falcon Vern Ljungren advised that in return for a drainage easement down Heights. the west side of the Fire Hall, and a 1?_' easement in front of the Playground Village Hall, the County will move 2500 yards of dirt stockpiled on Gage's Property in Falcon V~roods No. 2 to the Playground site tiding leased from the University and level it off. The apron in front of the Fire Station will be replaced, and the County will use high early strength concrete which won't tie us up for more than about 211 hours. Ljungren feels sure the County will be will- ing to move and level clay first and then move about a 1000 yards of black dirt onto the playground. site and level it as a top dressing. He also said the County will fill the ditch at the side and the hole at the end of the parking lot. He thinks they will have to dress the back fill with black dirt. Ljungren suggested a 50' driveway with a grass buffer strip. County are not equipped for leveling and Ljungren recommends we have that work done by someone equipped to do leveling, and he doesn't think the cost would be more than 80 to 120 dollars. The upper part of the playground areawill have to be cut and graded. Larson n7ould 1199 abpreciate help grading the upper part of the playground site because originally we agreed to have material hauled which-would have amounted to a maximum of X500.00. Grading would cost 3 to !~ huddred dollars. If the Village doesn't help with the cost of grading, it will just mean {hat they will have to spend some of the contributions they have collected for grading rather than equipment. Ljungren said he had received assurance from the University that it would be alright to use fencing now on location. Larsen said they would need additional fencing. The County will start moving the dirt 1'~onday. Ljungren said playground plans had been approved by the University. It was moved by 'J~rarkentien that L jungren's arrangement with the county as outlined above be approved. Seconded by Coppini and unanimously carried. David David McClung appeared before the Council to ask permission to ride McClung with the Falcon Heights Policemen as a civil defense man. He ad- vised that he had been working with the police in Arden Hills in this manner and that both he and the policemen found it advantageous; but he was leaving l~rden Hills because they couldn't buy him a uni- form. In Civil Defense, a complete uniform is mandatory. He has talked to both Johnson and Dachtera who said they would be able to do more work if there was another man in the car -- they would be able to leave the car to make investigations more .often. He is studying law at the University, but is going to switch to the Wm. Mitchell School of Law this fall. So far he has made enough at construction work to carry him through the school year. He would like active work of some kind while going to school -- police work especially because he intends to go into FBI work after graduation. He would be willing to ride with the officers without pay, hoping that if the time comes when we need an additional officer, we will give hire preference, ~larkentien says he doesn't think we should promise to give McClung preference on a police job and he doesn't want to obligate the Village. However, he will study the matter further, discussing it with the Public Safety Commissioner and others and let ",4cClung h ar from him later. Reappor- Letter from Senator Westin:.:. regarding reapportionment was read to tionment the Council. Nilsen and Utecht will make inquiries of acquaintances in the Senate seeking advice. License. It was moved by Warkentien, seconded by Nilsen and unanimously voted to grant Master Plumber's License #32 to date`.<Plumbing and Heating Co., 778 Grand, St. Paul, Minnesota. Fire It was moved by Shavor, seconded by Warkentien and unanimously voted School & to allow the Fire Department X125.00 for fire school and convention Convention expense com'oined. Ruggles Warkentien advised Weatherston had told him that the ditch on Ditch Ruggles is breaking up. Ljungren will check and. make recommendations. Fire Dept. Y1est Ent. Chief Plelson said the entrance to the west side of the Fire Department should be built up to eliminate the necessity of "gunning" the trucks to get them over the bump betvreen the entrance and the fire department floor. Ljungren will check and make recommendations. Physicals for It was the opinion of the Council that the Council should pass on any Volunteers new Volunteer Firemen and +,,t-lat they should have physical examinations. 1200 The Council is to pay for the physicals for just the new men. Warkentien will check rules and requirements. Resusitator It was moved by Warkentien, seconded by Shavor and unanimously voted that the Village order a Globe Resusitator at ~3l~.50 from Continental Safety Equipment, Inc., 1551 Selby Ave., St. Paul, 1~. Curfew Vdarkentien reported on the discussion of the curfew law at the RCPlIOA meeting where someone advanced the idea that inasmuch as 18 year olds are treated as juveniles under the law, they should go in on the curfew. Alilsen thinks we should try to tie in with St. Paul and the surrounding' communities and come up with uniform laws. Policing Utecht reported that Jerry Johnson went into active service in the reserves for two weeks and went to work at 7 during this time. It was moved by Warken tien, seconded by Coppini and unanimously voted that these hours be approved and he be paid his regular rate of pay. Bills On motion by Nilsen, seconded by Shavor, the following bills were ordered paid: LeRoy Humphrey, policing r.Rarch 72.00 Earl Smith, ditto 79.00 Jerome Johnson, use of personal car for policing 58.80 Kenneth Schmidt, policing T,Zarch 64.00 Henry J. Dachtera, policing March 71.00 Al Helbig, village work 17,50 Stan Schultz, village-; work and truck rental 83.75 Don r,Qerkel, village work ~ 5.00 Volunteers, fire and. drill time 221.00 Ethel E. V~Jhite, salary 1st half April 125.93 Rose ?'ribune, publishing annual statement 111..75 r,QcClain, Redman & Scheldt, office supplies 8.12 Ethel E. 'dlhite, stamps 1.00 U. S. Postmaster, stamps 8.00 Thorne Coal and Oil, fuel oil 108.16 Elvgren Paint Supply Co., recreation 22.00 Northern States Power, bill due 1~12~59 157„06 Falcon rei~,hts Hardware, supplies 3.~9 American Linen Supply Co. 9,56 Coates Trailer Service 30.00 Pure Oil, Gas oil, grease, etc. 11~7.l~6 ~Tm. E. Jastrol~r, fees and erp. Plbg. Insp. 56.00 crank 3. Lha, fees gas inspector 48.00 City of St. Paul, sewer rental 1st quarte~~ 1959 357G..11 Rose Tribune, Pub. Ord. 51 and notice hearing 10.6Z~ Z~Fayne Z"J. Anderson, preparing annual financial stmt lOC.00 Farnham Sta. & School Sup. Co., chalkboard & easel 11.50 Gary Pdiemczyk, custodian skating rink 78.50 John ~:.ardner, custodian skating rink 15.50 Adjournment On otion, the meeting adjourned at 12.10. ~~ ~' / Approved ~ Signed f" -' ' , ~.~ayor ~ Clerk