HomeMy WebLinkAbout09-06-1979 Park Board Minutes PARK BOARD
September, 1979
Minutes but no agenda or packet
September 6, 1979
The regular meeting of the Park Board was called to order at 7:58 p.m. by Chairman
Ina Liljedahl . Members present: Tom Shaughnessy, Larry Crouse, Peter Scherer, and
Ken Johnson. Members absent: Gary Foster, Charles Cheesebrough, and Council liaison
Richard Zelinka. Also present was Don Volk.
The budget worksheet was reviewed, and Mrs. Liljedahl asked if there were any questions ,
changes or additions to be made. Mr. Scherer moved to accept it, and Mr. Johnson
seconded the motion. All were in favor. Motion declared passed.
In reference to the hockey rink at Sunrise Park, Mr. Shaughnessy had researched the
dimensions and provided the following figures: These were 200 feet long by 85 wide,
and the sideboards should be 40-48 inches in height. Mr. Crouse felt that a pleasure
rink could be put up with the option of upgrading it to a hockey rink if that became
necessary. Don Volk had some information to present on the proposed hockey rink. The
old rink had been torn down, and the south rink was the one still standing, and would
be repairable for two to three years. The Hockey Association would be sending a list
of the items that needed to be done on this , and these would include repairing the
equipment doors , grading, replacing some support posts and patching some areas in
plywood. The biggest expense would be the grading. The expenses for a new hockey
rink would be high. The only written quote available was on lumber, which would run
$4,283.50. These were 2 x 12s with a 40-year guarantee and treated against rotting.
Hardware needed to put the rink together would run $835.04. An electrician had not
been available to look at the lighting yet for rewiring, so there was some question
on the estimate for that. Mercury fixtures were more expensive, by about a third, but
would be more efficient than incandescent lighting; in one years ` use, the savings
would run about $1,000, and they would pay for themselves in a little over a year.
It was questionable whether the present 200 amp service could handle two rinks. There
were 12 incandescent fixtures on the present rink and the new rink would require 12
mercury fixtures. If incandescent lights were used on both rinks , a 400 amp service
would be needed, but the 200 amp service could be adequate if the mercury fixtures were
used on the new rink. Also if the wiring from the old rink could be used, the costs
would be cut by about $1,500. However, these things could not be determined until an
electrician looked at it. The estimate would run about $5,000 total for lighting
alone, and the total cost for the new rink would run $10-11,000 for materials and
handling of fixtures and wiring. Don Volk had talked to a member of the Hockey Associ-
ation, and they had not been aware that they were going to be asked to provide the
labor for the rink. Otherwise, labor would run roughly $2-4,000. Mrs. Liljedahl asked
if the Hockey Association had provided any figures or estimates on how much more they
would be using the rink, and questioned if two hockey rinks were really needed in view
of the costs. Mr. Crouse suggested a pleasure rink be constructed so that at some
time it could be converted into a hockey rink; Don Volk felt that there was a definate
need for a pleasure rink in that area, but that unless the Hockey Association had a
large growth, a second hockey rink was not needed other than to practice on. Mr.
Johnson asked what the difference in cost would be between a pleasure rink and a hockey
rink; Don Volk suggested that the railroad ties on hand be used as a border to flood
against, which would eliminate any costs other than grading the interior for a pleasure
rink. There would be no cost involved for lighting as there were four 1500-watt incan-
descent lights from the old rink, and this would be sufficient. Mrs. Liljedahl sug-
gested that the rink be made the size of a hockey rink; she also felt the rinks should
not be placed side by side like they have been in the past, and asked if there were
some way of enforcing no hockey skating on the pleasure rink. Don Volk indicated that
the only way to handle that would be to employ someone to supervise the rink. Also,
there were no set hours for the warming house, and the only time it was open was when
hockey was being played. Don felt there was sufficient money in the budget to employ
a high schooler at minimum wage to.man the warming house, for instance, three or four
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September 6, 1979
hours in the evening and on weekends and holidays. The Board generally felt that the
costs for a second hockey rink were too high and it could not be handled at this time.
Don Volk also pointed out that there would be two more parks to maintain next year,
which was an additional cost. These would be the Stanley park in Sunset Oaks , and
Shenendoah park, which was larger. At present the mowing was on a strict 2-week sched-
ule to cover all the parks; although another tractor for maintenance was not on the
1980 budget, it would be needed by the next year, as well as additional help on main-
tenance. He noted that the work on the park in Sunset Oaks had just been finished,
and Mrs. Liljedahl felt it should be noted that Mr. Stanley had done a wonderful job
on the park. There had been nothing done yet on Shenendoah Park, and Mrs. Liljedahl
asked if there had been a time stipulation on completion.
The Park Board felt that the lighting for the second hockey rink would be worthwhile
looking into and reviewing, although it was felt that in view of the costs and the
fact that it was not needed that much, the second hockey rink would not be put in at
this time. The only item that needed to go through the Council on the pleasure rink
would be the grading, which Don Volk estimated at about $300. This would include
surveying at about $125. Generally, grading was needed once every three years , so
this would be an intermittent expense. Don Volk suggested that the grading and sur-
veying for both the present rink and the pleasure rink be handled together for a total
of $600, and presented to the Council that way. Mrs. Liljedahl so moved, and Mr.
Shaughnessy seconded the motion. All were in favor. Motion declared passed. The
second hockey rink would not be put up at this time; a pleasure rink would be put up,
and the old hockey rink repaired. Mr. Crouse asked that benches be provided for chang-
ing skates and so forth when the warming house was not open. Don Volk felt this would
not be a problem, and they could be put together either from the railroad ties or some
old benches on hand could be rehabilitated for the purpose.
Don Volk noted that a slab had been laid underneath the shelter, and several members
had noticed that the park was used frequently, both by groups and informally. Don Volk
pointed out that any playground equipment despite size or condition made a great deal
of difference in the use of a park. Mrs. Liljedahl suggested looking at updating and
replacing playground equipment in the various parks , and perhaps taking a trip around
to review them as far as better or more suitable equipment.
Don Volk had available some brochures on items that had been included in the 1980 budget;
these were the landscaper and ballfield drag, and lime and ballfield markers. Presently
the City had chain-link drags at the parks, but these were not adequate for any land-
scaping.
Next on the agenda was discussion pertaining to the LAWCON grant denial . The City had
received a letter from Metro Council to the effect that the grant would not be consid-
ered for funding due to the fact that it was a general rural use area and an active
recreation project. Mrs. Liljedahl had talked to Phyllis Hanson from Metro, and had
gotten a more complete explanation of the reasons for the denial . The City was consid-
ered "general rural" because there were no sewer or water services available, and be-
cause of this classification, only a "passive" grant would be considered. Lino Park
was considered "active" because it had a ballfield and other recreational acitivities
proposed in the future. Under this criteria, Country Lakes would also be considered
active because in the future it too would be used for something other than passive.
Passive uses would cover things such as putting in a nature trail through swamp land,
^' and never using the area for anything else but that. Mrs. Liljedahl had gone through
the material from Metro that had come with the grant application, and the only refer-
ence to these criteria read, "All applications from rural centers will be considered,
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September 6, 1979
10-*N active and passive," and "those parts of the rural service areas outside of the rural
service centers, only applications for passive recreation will be considered. " Mrs.
Liljedahl felt it was not very clear, but it was this wording that the rejection of
the grant had been based on. There had been no further defination of active and pas-
sive uses. She also felt that the part of the grant dealing with nature trails and
upgrading of the area were passive and therefore still valid; however, Phyllis Hanson
had said that despite that, it was still an active park, and outside of a rural center.
Under these criteria, a grant would not be possible in the forseeable future.
The Metro meeting had not been attended because the letter of rejection had been received
before that. Mrs . Liljedahl recommended that a Metro meeting coming up in February be
attended. At that time Metro reviewed the new criteria for the next year for grants,
and if the City wanted to have a voice in that, or contest it, that would be the proper
time. She also suggested preparing for it by doing some background work beforehand.
She also suggested that Mr. Locher look into the situation, as it was a federal grant,
yet Metro was controlling who was being considered for it based on their own criteria
and not the government's criteria.
Mr. Crouse felt that there must be an appeal process and that this should be explored
if only to learn more about the reasons for denial , since there seemed to be some con-
tradictions. He had spoken to Mr. Johnboys about the situation in terms of the Metro
criteria being discriminatory and not very just, and it had seemed to be his feeling
that the criteria had perhaps not been worked out well enough, and that the City had a
right to ask why the grant had been denied, and to appeal that. He had also felt they
had a right to a meeting with Metro; there had been a meeting of the Board that set
,-� the criteria to discuss projects at 3 p.m. the day the letter had been received which
could have been attended, but Mr. Crouse felt there had not been enough time to do so.
He pointed out that the City is in the Metro area, yet considered rural because there
was no metropolitan center, and because of this their criteria were not being met.
Also, Metro Council itself was responsible for the lack of sewer and water services,
and yet the City did have sewer service available about half a mile away. The forsee-
able future had been used as a criteria in determininq active, non-fundable parks ,
yet the possibility of sewer becoming available in the forseeable future had not been
considered. Mr. Shaughnessy asked what the definition of a metropolitan center was,
and Mr. Crouse said it would be a rural center like Wyoming--a town center without
sewer sercive. These could be considered for active recreation, but for some reason,
Lino Lakes was not considered a rural center, since it was in the Metro area and did
not have sewer service; however, sewers were available within the City, and Lino Park
was in the town center, considering the major crossroads and the population concentra-
tion, other than that in the far south, or Centerville. Mr. Crouse had prepared in
writing his thoughts on these contradictions in the Metro criteria, to the effect that
they seemed to have been applied in a discriminatory way. He would have a copy of this
available for the Park Board. He also pointed out that if these criteria had not been
applied uniformly in any instance, or if they could be caught in any mistakes in apply-
ing it in a discriminatory manner, there was a federal law which then determined that
Metro was at fault and the grant would have to be reviewed. Mr. Crouse noted that the
grant was federal money, and that it could be delegated to the legislature or county
rather than to Metro Council . Metro handled it now, as they had the administrative
perogative and was felt to be the most appropriate agency, but that if they did not
fulfill their function properly, they would be in an uncomfortable position. Mrs.
Liljedahl indicated that there was a list which the Park Board had of all the differ-
ent areas that have been considered or are being considered, and suggested these be
checked for areas similar to Lino Lakes to see if the criteria had been applied in the
same way. She also noted that the downstairs facilities would not have been considered
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September 6, 1979
i'I, for funding because of the lack of sewer and water, and the upstairs would not have
been considered because it was general use. Don Volk suggested that the Park Board
find out which areas in the Metro area were categorized the same as Lino Lakes , and
send those communities letters asking if they have applied for or received a LAWCON
grant and if so, what was the grant awarded for; rather than working through Metro,
the Park Board should work through the municipalities and also find out if they had
received any grants in the past. Mrs. Liljedahl noted that there were ten areas
classified general rural on the list. . It was also mentioned that these communities
might not be willing to cooperate. Don Volk indicated that Anoka County was planning
on spending large amounts of money on the county park in Lino Lakes , and asked if they
had applied for LAWCON to cover this, as it was an active recreational use, and Anoka
was considered general rural . There was some question as to whether this classifica-
tion was for Anoka City or Anoka County.
Mr. Crouse suggested that the criteria situation be looked into immediately in terms
of handling it before all the funding was allocated, as this would create a different
kind of problem. Mrs. Liljedahl felt that Mr. Locher should be asked to look into
the legalities, and the fees would have to be put up to Council ; The Park Board would
need the approval of the Council to pursue the matter in any case, as it concerned the
City as a whole. Mr. Shaughnessy moved that the Council be furnished with whatever
they needed in order to process the matter further, and that it be made a priority
matter. Don Volk suggested this be amended to request that the Park Board be given
the authority to do whatever necessary to investigate the matter. Mrs. Liljedahl felt
the legal aspect should also be handled by Mr. Locher. Mr. Crouse felt that initially
a letter requesting clarification of the criteria and its application should be sent,
either by Mr. Locher or the Council .
Mr. Scherer felt the grant should not be counted on, and that the Park Board should go
ahead with the building. Mr. Crouse suggested that 30 days be taken to investigate
the LAWCON matter, and if Metro' s position remained unchanged, the Board should make
a decision on the building. Mrs. Liljedahl felt the issue with Metro did not only con-
cern the building for Lino Park, but any future grants as well , and the criteria should
be looked into and changed if possible. If action wasn't taken at this point, the City
would not be in a position to pursue it later on. Mr. Shaughnessy repeated his motion
to have the Council look into the matter. The motion was seconded by Mr. Johnson. All
were in favor. Motion declared passed. Mrs. Liljedahl noted that any of the Park
Board members could be contacted concerning this, and felt it should be handled as soon
as possible.
Mr. Shaughnessy had received a call in reference to the shed on the park property where
the house had been comdemned, as to whether it could be removed to the new residence;
he had referred them to Mr. Zelinka. Don Volk noted that the shed was well-built and
in good condition, and had been used for storage. Mr. Shaughnessy asked if moving the
shed would require a permit.
Mrs. Liljedahl had also received a call about one of the parks being locked up; Don
Volk indicated that they had probably been referring to the driveway gate, which was
always locked as it was for City us.e only.
Mr. Shaughnessy raised a question as to the piece of park land indicated on the map
for East Birch. Addition, and asked what the reasons had been for choosing that parti-
cular piece, as. it was located near the Centerville boundary, which was commercial
property. He had thought a different piece had been chosen. The July 2 minutes were
consulted on this and Don Volk indicated it had been discussed as a playground/tot lot
type of thing for children. Mr. Shaughnessy noted that there was a 5-acre park in
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September 6, 1979
Centerville nearby. Don Volk felt that as this was undeveloped, it should not be
considered, and when it was developed, the Park Board had the option of selling the
lot. Also, Lino Lakes should not plan on benefiting from what Centerville may or may
not plan to do, and with 35 home sites , a tot lot was needed. Mrs. Liljedahl noted
that in Apple Valley, there was a policy that a certain number of tot lots were required
to be put in by the builder per so many homes. Don Volk also pointed out that in
Chicago, they were going through the process of buying corner home sites to put in
tot lots, and there was a policy of so many tot lots per a certain number of blocks.
Mr. Scherer felt that the Board had too many small lots for parks, considering that
the minimum lot size was 1 acre. Mrs. Liljedahl felt, however, that the Park Board
should provide certain services, one of which was organized tot lots for children.
Mr. Scherer felt maintenance for these was expensive, and wouldn't leave enough funds
for development. Don Volk indicated that the idea for tot lots was to put in zero-
maintenance equipment so only the mowing was necessary. He also pointed out that when
sewer and water become available, the 1-acre lots would be split, and the play areas
for children would have to be provided for. Mr. Scherer again suggested that land be
taken by the Park Board rather than cash, and held as an investment to be sold later.
Mr. Crouse was in favor of taking land rather than cash because of the low valuation
which reflected land values of several years ago, and not its present worth. Mr.
Scherer asked if the land could be handled in this way; Mr. Crouse recalled that Mr.
Zelinka had indicated it could be done, but Mrs. Liljedahl felt that there were res-
trictions on this type of thing, and thought it should be looked into further. Mr.
Shaughnessy raised the question of whether taxes needed to be paid on the profits if
and when the land was sold. Don Volk felt that the land could not be taken with the
intent of reselling it, but it could be taken with the intent of providing some kind
of park facility.
In reference to the LAWCON grant, the matter would beinvestigated and if by the next
meeting there was no further information or possibility of something being done this
year on the grant, then a decision on the building would be made at that time. Mr..
Crouse suggested that there were possibly other areas thatcould be looked into such
as rebates or tax allowances. This had been discussed before the LAWCON grant was
applied for, but had never been pursued, such as the solar heating or other features
that would be cost and energy efficient. Also important was the construction, and
the possibility of adding these features at a later time, and also having the building
expandable. He felt these things should be addressed. Don Volk will be looking into
some of these other areas, and Mr. Crouse will check into any other money available
or rebates and so forth for solar heating, energy efficient construction, and so on.
Mr. Scherer moved to adjourn at 9:25 p.m. Mr Shaughnessy seconded the motion. All
were in favor. Motion declared passed.