HomeMy WebLinkAbout11/08/2000 Council MinutesCITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
CITY OF LINO LAKES
MINUTES
DATE : November 8, 2000
TIME STARTED : 5:30 p.m.
TIME ENDED : 11:35 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT : Council Member Carlson, Dahl, O'Donnell,
Reinert, and Mayor Bergeson
: None
MEMBERS ABSENT
Staff members present: Administration Director, Dan Tesch; City Engineer, John
Powell; Economic Development Director, Brian Wessel(part); 'c Development
Assistant, Mary Divine (part); and City Planner, Jeff Smyser
CSAH 49 RECONSTRUCTION UPDATE, . OHN
Staff distributed a copy of a letter from the City t C my , ngineer. The letter
included a list of questions regarding options f ,t. Staff also distributed a copy
Y
of a letter of response from the County and .' ist o,.•ns. Staff advised the County
Engineer will review the options for the pro t this ening.
Mayor Bergeson advised Ms. Marg , • , County Commissioner, is present this
evening.
Mr. Jon Olson, County E c forward and stated the purpose of the meeting is
to give a brief history of the . ect and present options that are available to the City. He
reviewed the backgrooject and noted the proposed project was discussed
with the City Council °$ , 2000. That meeting is what led to the letter from the
City and the County's r= • onse.
Mr. Olson reviewed option A noting that was the plan that was originally proposed in
April 2000.
Mr. Olson referred to option B noting it is a modified proposal that was presented to the
City Council in August 2000. He advised the problem with option B is it is trying to fit a
wide road section into a narrow right-of-way. The option will require an additional 5'
wide trail easement in some areas. A median could be put in place but would prohibit
left-hand turns in all locations except where absolutely necessary. The County would
purchase 100' minimum right-of-way.
Mr. Olson summarized the City's letter and the County's response advising that the road
section cannot be limited to 52' or 62' feet if it remains a County road. The County will
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
consider the possibility of a number of lanes being phased in over time. Neither the
County nor the City has an jurisdiction over reducing the speed limit on the roadway.
The project intends to include a signal light for the transition from Anoka County to
Ramsey County at County Road J. Ramsey County has requested that the intersection be
completed as part of the project.
Mr. Olson continued advising that since the Public Information Meeting and the last
Council work session, Anoka County has revised its proposed cross-section for this
roadway so that the roadway includes two (2) lanes in each direction, a median, a right
and left turn lanes were appropriate. The County has removed the eight (8) foot shoulders
on each side of the roadway from its proposed design, and has lessened its right-of-way
requirements from 60 feet on each side of the centerline to 50 feet on each side of the
centerline. These changes have been made in response to public opposition to the project
and specifically to the concern about the width and distance to existing structures. The
result of this change will be that in addition to the 50 foot of roadw ; asement on one
side of the road, an additional trail easement may be necessary ,r ere City has
requested that trails be installed. These changes are curren n�• ed the design work
being conducted by TKDA.
Mr. Olson reviewed option B and a drawing of wh. the urr roposal would look like.
He also reviewed option C noting it is a narrowersion of option B.
Council Member O'Donnell asked for clarif
of road and the right-of-way. Mr. Olson 1
for each option.
garding the options relating to width
right-of-way and curb to curb width
The City Engineer advised opt'. oa : a c� bination of options. There are design issues
that have not yet been wor
Council Member 0' t e nnell ed that a 62' foot roadway is shown as an option with a
median.
The City Engineer asked option C requires a 5' trail easement. Mr. Olson indicated
option C does require a 5' trail easement in some locations.
The City Engineer explained why the 5' easement is needed in some locations.
Council Member Dahl asked why a three -(3) lane roadway with a shared middle lane is
not an option. Mr. Olson stated that is not a safe design for a roadway unless there is a
lower speed limit.
Council Member Dahl suggested shared lanes for left turns only. She asked if that is an
option if the right turn lanes are only in strategic locations.
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CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Mr. Olson advised a three -(3) lane roadway is not an option on a road that has a speed
limit over 40 m.p.h.
Council Member Reinert asked who has jurisdiction over the speed limit. Mr. Olson
advised the Commissioner of Transportation determines speed limits. He explained the
process used to change a speed limit noting most roadways under 55 M.P.H. will go up
after a speed study is conducted.
Council Member Reinert asked how the City could end up with a speed limit for a new
roadway as compared to the roadway that currently exists.
The City Engineer advised that if a speed study is conducted, it would include the habits
of drivers currently using the road.
Council Member Carlson expressed concern regarding receivingrrent information
r
and options right before this meeting. She noted the Council h requ, ed the
information prior to the meeting. She stated each option as o" 105 120' of right-of-
way that perhaps is not used. She stated that is too much ghtf f She noted the
meeting in March 2000 is the first the Council heard a,. =s pry ect. At that meeting,
traffic counts and a map showing the proposed pro ct 06 was distributed. She
stated that was not enough information. There h scussion that the project is
from Lake Drive to County Road J, however , area ` hows the project to 35W. She
expressed concern regarding residents on th north d of the project.
Council Member Carlson stated neat ' Shoreview plan nor the Comprehensive Plan
for Lino Lakes calls for a divided ��� `� "° e current Comprehensive Plan calls for a
four -(4) lane undivided highw` Sh :'view plan calls for a two (2) lane highway.
The City of Shoreview has . eed to not extend the project north of Chippewa
for seven (7) years. The f.: a 62' wide three (3) lane highway south of
Chippewa with the s .ing o, anes to be controlled by the City of Shoreview. The
City of Shoreview has : ey County to come back with another plan because they
do not want a five (5)1. e hi hway. The City of Shoreview will reject the current plan.
She stated the City need o work with the City of Shoreview on this project. She
proposed option F, which includes the Council vote on options A-E and the City work
with the City of Shoreview and the two (2) counties to find a compromise.
Mayor Bergeson inquired about the distinction between this project and the project five
(5) years out. Mr. Olson stated the City has put pressure on the County to include the
northern stretch of roadway in the County's plans. The schedule for funding on that
portion is 2003-2006. He stated he is willing to meet with the City of Shoreview and
Ramsey County to discuss options. He advised, however, that he will be designing the
highway, not a committee.
The City Engineer referred to a memo from the City of Shoreview to the Metropolitan
Council. The City of Shoreview has requested a regional perspective of the plan. The
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Metropolitan Council has indicated Highway 49 is a regional roadway and should be
constructed as such.
Council Member Dahl stated that each of the options has a median from 4' to 15' wide.
She asked if the County is open to eliminating the median.
Mr. Olson stated that the direction he has been given includes a median. A median will
also be constructed on the bridge.
Council Member Dahl inquired about the length of the roadway. Mr. Olson indicated the
roadway is approximately two (2) miles long.
Council Member Carlson stated that until recently, the goal of the Council and
community is to reach a compromise that will keep in mind the rights of the residents and
provide a thoroughfare for the community. She read a quote from oreview Council
Member regarding the forcing of traffic. She stated she wants Coue it to vote on this
at the next Council meeting. A discussion should be at the t unc x work session
prior to that meeting.
Council Member Reinert stated there are three (3)
concerns of residents. The options will be voted
a bridge that is in need of repair. He inquire
Mr. Olson stated the City would have t
improvement would include a four
review and the Council approved
not address the
owever, the City will still have
optio for the bridge.
an to improve the bridge. The
ed highway. A study was submitted for
Mayor Bergeson inquired a A h idth of the existing right-of-way and the process
used to acquire right -of- 01n advised the current right-of-way varies from 66'
to 83' feet. The right- f -way ready been dedicated on the west side from Aggrate
Lane to north of Blue explained the process used to acquire right-of-way and
the factors that determi ~ thvalue of property. If an agreement is not reached, the
eminent domain processill be used. He noted that 85% of property is acquired through
negotiation.
Council Member O'Donnell asked if the alignment for the road is the same for each
option. Mr. Olson advised the alignment of the road is the same as the right-of-way
except for 1 mile where there is vacant land.
Council Member O'Donnell requested a document that shows each option and the impact
to each business and home. Mr. Olson advised he does not have that information and the
County does not plan to provide that.
Council Member O'Donnell stated the project has a significant impact to some residents.
The City needs to understand that impact. Homes and business may be lost.
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Mr. Olson advised the County would acquire a minimum of 100' of right-of-way. This
has been part of the County's plan for decades. The City has agreed to that. The
maximum impact to homes or businesses is 12' of right-of-way.
Mayor Bergeson inquired about the x's on the map. Mr. Olson advised the setback line is
40' feet. The x's indicate where the 100' right-of-way is out of that 40' setback. There
are currently about six (6) cases that the setback won't be met.
Council Member Carlson inquired about the width of the roadway now, especially by the
townhomes. Mr. Olson indicated he does not have that number.
Council Member Carlson asked if 20' feet of additional right-of-way will be requested as
the project goes down Lake Drive. The City Engineer advised that as development
occurs, the other side of the roadway will require 20' of right-of-way.
Council Member Carlson stated this is another example of thin
without realizing the significance. The City is giving the C
paying for it.
The City Engineer stated the City is giving the Cou
on the project. A typical County plan includes 6
line.
Mr. Olson advised that as part of the C
right-of-way. In 1994, a letter was
right-of-way for County road dev
must allow for a 30 day review
it lowers the cost of project
Ms. Margaret Langfi - d,
there are two (2) other
information prior to the
to design safe roads. It i
before Council
nts without them
eas nt but is saving money
ight-of-way from the center
Plan, there is a requirement for
e County asking cities to consider
ere is a new law in effect where the cities
ounty. Right-of-way is sought after because
o a way for development to help defray costs.
Cou ommissioner, came forward and reminded the Council
he apologized that the Council did not receive this
ee ng. She stated it is the primary job of the County Engineer
so the job of elected officials. This issue is not about how the
road looks or how close it is too homes. The project only affects six (6) properties. She
stated the County does not want to take property. However, the County can not fix the
state issue of road problems. The Metropolitan Council feels the project is appropriate.
A solution is needed to move traffic. She stated that possibly the traffic volume amount
is negotiable. She stated it would be helpful to have a meeting with both cities and
Counties. The City has hard choices to make. The State has told the County to do this
project. The County won't be back for this project for 4-5 years and that may be too late
The City and County need to think about the future.
Council Member O'Donnell asked if the Council has received information before about
the six (6) properties that are affected. Mr. Olson advised six (6) properties will be non-
conforming because of the setbacks.
5
•
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8 200
Council Member O'Donnell advised he needs that level of detail to better understand the
impact and to take a vote. Mr. Olson stated the City Engineer has the information to
determine which properties are non -conforming.
Council Member O'Donnell stated he needs to know how many homes and businesses
will be lost and which ones.
Ms. Langfield stated the City does not have to conform. There are creative things that
can be done. Some homes and businesses will have to be moved.
Council Member O'Donnell advised he can not make a decision without that information.
Mayor Bergeson directed the City Engineer to work with the County to get a summary of
that information. The City Engineer advised that information can be obtained. However,
assumptions about the roadway will have to be made.
Mr. Olson stated information about the appraisal will not be
property owner will lost approximately 17 feet.
e average
Council Member Reinert stated the big concern is t a . th o e roadway and right-of-
way. He asked why the County can't build a roathan 100' feet of right-of-
way. Mr. Olson advised the County is buying ht -o ay so it won't be an issue in
the future if it is needed. Additional right -o sway i ' eeded for utilities and a path. Most
of the right-of-way will be green space t �� ada constructed under the minimum
design, it is probable that the road w to . e widened in the future. A standard
arterial roadway in Anoka Count of right-of-way.
Council Member Reinert st
way. He stated he would
reasonable but flexib'_'t is
ounty is pushing the limits with 100' of right -of -
other option. Option C seems to be the most
Mr. Olson stated he has is . rection regarding the design of the road from the County.
Council Member Reinert stated his goal is to have the road constructed in as small a
space as possible. Mr. Olson explained the reason for different widths of a roadway.
Council Member Reinert asked if there are any variations possible regarding the width of
the berms and median in option C. Mr. Olson stated he believes the City will be very
unhappy with option C. Option C is available except for the intersections at Ash and
Birch.
Council Member Carlson asked if option C will be wider and Birch and Ash. Mr. Olson
advised option B would be used at the intersections of Birch and Ash.
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Council Member Carlson stated she would like to see a drawing where the roadway is in
relation to the houses. She stated there are six (6) properties at the intersections that will
be impacted. She stated she needs more detail.
Mr. Olson stated he has provided the drawings to the City Engineer. Buildings and
setbacks are indicated on the drawings. There are two (2) businesses at the intersection
that are non -conforming. The property owners will be compensated for market value,
business value, and relocation costs.
Mayor Bergeson directed the City Engineer to make copies of the drawings available to
Council Members and residents.
Ms. Gail Weiner, 6356 Hodgson Road, came forward and stated she is representing her
neighborhood. She stated the project will directly affect her and her neighbors. She
stated the neighbors have had discussions regarding the project an. a ,ve indicated it is all
or nothing. Phasing the project is a problem relating to selling pro E y. The property
is lower in value and can't be sold. She stated the roadway a 1 �` 19' ` et from her front
door. The roadway will be 18-20 feet from all the neigh.; s'<,•nt rs. She indicated
there is no compromise for this neighborhood. She std` ; ` o would have to be
moved back or bought out completely. She stated e buy out by
approximately 10' feet. If the County takes 100- roperty will lose value. At this
point, no one can sell their homes because no 11 pa arket value. She stated the
County is in the position to mess with every e's li`; s on this side of the street. She
stated she would rather take the money
The City Engineer advised the ed '� e would be 40' feet from the road. There
would be 50-60' feet to the eday.
Mr. Ken Reichert, 6669 ' '' lac , came forward and stated his property backs up to
Hodgson Road. He s ted he `' • ciates where the County Engineer and the County
Commissioner are co
°,. Their objective is to move traffic. He asked if the
����
residents of Lino Lakes a+ e r sponsible to make traffic run smoother for other
communities. The main • jective of this road is to make traffic connection. He stated
that eventually this community won't care and there will be nothing for residents to
protect. This project will affect everyone in the City of Lino Lakes. He asked who was
going to build the road before turn back money became available. He referred to an
earlier plan that did not include a divided highway.
Mr. Olson advised the County had the choice of taking the road back from MnDOT. The
County chose to take the road back to be eligible for the funds.
The City Engineer advised the City was never going to be reconstructing this roadway.
Mr. Olson stated MnDOT may have had a conceptual plan that did not show a divided
highway.
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
The City Engineer stated that project was for the original bridge project to Birch Street.
Mr. Reichert stated that the point he is making is that the County gets money and they
have to spend it. This is a very emotional issue. The residents here are not concerned
about Blaine residents going to Blaine. The project will end up with additional traffic.
Six (6) homes are affected. He stated he wants to make sure the Council is representing
the City and not the County. He stated he agrees with safety issues, however, does not
see how it will be safer with the additional traffic. He stated the speed limit is being
stuffed down the resident's throats. He added that complaints can reduce the speed limit
on that road.
Mayor Bergeson advised the County Engineer has indicated what typically happens when
a traffic study is done.
Mr. Reichert stated he does not believe the speed limit would up. `=; width of the
road is a big concern. Another concern is the divided highw a dian. Turns will
be unsafe. If the road goes to 55 m.p.h. people will drive there will be even
more accidents. People will be losing property. How ck out of their
driveways across five (5) lanes of traffic? He statethe s to represent all the
citizens of Lino Lakes. Living on the roadway is nly issue. He stated his family
has enjoyed living here but will move if this w _oes ough. He stated he feels very
strongly about this issue because it will ruin eco unity of Lino Lakes.
Ms. Theresa Weinkauf, TRW Tax S X739 ake Drive, stated she has had her
business here for 12 years and liv ffi 3 ' o es for 25 years. She stated people losing
their homes is a lot more impor . h' osing her business.
Mr. Richard Anderson, 6 + e H on Drive, came forward and asked if his home
meets the current set . ick.
The City Engineer indite 'ed "s home does not meet the setback. He advised he will
investigate why it does n meet the current setback.
Mr. Anderson asked if someone from the County will come out and discuss the value of
his property that is lost. He stated the impact will be dramatic. A roadway that goes from
one lane to two (2) lane will also impact this neighborhood tremendously. The accesses
have to be controlled or there will be more accidents. He stated he does not want to live
on his property if the project goes through. He begged the Council to choose option E.
He stated the City should slow down traffic. He indicated he does not care if the bridge
falls down. If the project goes through he stated he wants his house torn down. He stated
he researched the area and was told the road would not change. He stated he will not be
able to get his car out of the driveway with the new road. He stated he cannot sell his
house now because of the project. He stated the County will have to buy him out if the
road goes in.
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Mr. Olson stated there will be no additional right-of-way purchased in this case and
between Aggrate and Blue Heron.
Mr. Anderson stated the proposed road would decrease the value of his property.
However, the County does not see it that way since no additional right-of-way is needed.
Mr. Olson stated property value going down because of a new road is subjective. He
stated he would be surprised if an appraisal would show decreased value.
Mr. Anderson stated that is not correct. A new roadway would be like building 35E in
your backyard. He stated he will not be compensated and this will happen to other
families as well.
The City Engineer advised the County is pursuing a 100' right-of-way, not 120'.
Mr. Olson advised that when the property was platted, Hodgso 'ncipal arterial.
It was platted with 50' of right-of-way. He stated he can't irgi;that appraiser
would say the situation would change.
Mayor Bergeson advised Mr. Anderson and other rsid is th ey are free to obtain an
appraisal.
Mr. Anderson asked how his house got buil st place when the County knew
about the road in 1974. Fifteen years 1 as built and the City allowed it. He
suggested he may have legal recours he y and County.
Mayor Bergeson directed the ine'= o investigate this situation and contact Mr.
Anderson.
Ms. Dana Skibsted, 671 Ho :,• ', stated there are a lot of safety issues and she has
children. She stated s heard about center medians. She questioned why the
medians can't be pamte � S e asked how emergency vehicle will get to her home. She
indicated U-turns are no afe. She asked why the County won't put in a painted median
and lower the speed limit. She stated there is a trailer park there with a lot of people and
a bus company that needs to get buses in and out.
Mayor Bergeson advised the City will get input from the Police Department and Fire
Department regarding emergency vehicle access.
Mr. Olson stated conflict points are not eliminated with painted medians. The traffic
knows where it should be with medians. The median is an important part of the project.
Ms. Skibsted stated she has lived here for 16 years and the road does need work. She
stated accidents have decreased with the additional stop signs. She stated a 15' foot
median is ridiculous. She stated she commutes and drives slowly and has yet to see an
9
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
accident in front of her house. She stated she wants to live and work in this community.
A freeway will destroy the community.
Mr. Greg Gongeo, 6011 Hodgson, Farmers Insurance, asked if his business is non-
conforming. He stated it is absurd to let violators determine the speed limit. He stated
the City should be above the state method.
Mr. Olson stated there are two (2) businesses at the intersection that are non -conforming.
Mr. Gongeo wondered how much of a driveway his business will have. He also inquired
about access and parking for his business.
Mr. Olson referred to a map indicating the non -conforming properties. He stated he can't
comment at this point on the impact of parking.
Mr. Gongeo stated that without parking and a driveway, he doe f of h`: a business. He
asked if the County would buy him out.
Mr. Olson advised he has indicated the buy out proce e.
value, impact and improvements to the value.
aiser will look at land
Mr. Gongeo stated he disagrees that there are o ( usinesses that will be
impacted. A business cannot continue with
g.
Council Member Reinert inquired a., proposed entrance into the parking lot from the
roadway. Mr. Olson indicated th en ce to the parking lot.
Mr. John Hudgens, 661 Pel :g ' stated he has many concerns for the community of
Lino Lakes. He stated a his e is only meant for a reliever of freeway traffic.
The freeway traffic is . regio,. � oblem that is being forced on the City of Shoreview
and Lino Lakes. The , an be made wider but the County won't do it. He stated
this issue is indirectly a'ut afety. The roadway is not necessary unsafe now. Stop
lights and a bike lane are eeded. A new road will not make it safer. He stated he wants
the Council to reject the options then work on the speed limit issue. He said the speed
limit should be lowered. The City of Shoreview is concerned about what Lino Lakes will
do. He stated he has a problem with any Council Members saying the issue is only 2.2
miles. Everyone knows that what is done here will be done in other sections. The City
does not want to look at that because then there will be even more problems. He stated
he would applaud the Council coming to a vote on this issue. He stated he does not know
what else the Council needs to look at. A vote for the project would be irrespective to
residents and the City of Shoreview. He indicated he would rather do nothing to the road.
The City can go from there after the options are voted down.
Ms. Lynn Heaser, 218 Aggrate Lane, came forward and clarified that her property is
currently in violation of the setback. She stated that for the first time tonight, she heard
10
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
compassion from the City Council. It looks like the City will work toward what is best
for the City and its residents. She stated Ms. Langfield previously spoke about this issue
with compassion and understanding. However, after tonight it is clear where she stands
on this issue. She requested a copy of the road map noting the median is 15' sloping to 4'
and will not change. She stated the residents want to remind the Council there are 30
homes that will be affected. She asked that the Council take a vote on November 27,
2000.
Mayor Bergeson advised Council Member Carlson has suggested a vote be taken on
November 27, 2000. A vote on the issue will be discussed at the work session prior to
the Council meeting.
Council Member Carlson stated she would like to poll the Council regarding action on
November 27, 2000.
Ms. Heaser stated the Council is aware of the impact. The Cit
The City can mandate the County to do the bridge and light
had indicated. She indicated she will put up the first $10
lights. The Parks Department should then finish the tr
11 the County no.
revious plans
of afford the
Mr. Dan Javis, 6179 Hodgson, came forward and . i. just moved here. He stated
the project is totally ridiculous. The plan wilthe rod worse and even more
unsafe. He expressed concern regarding res encs T ng to pull out of their driveways.
He stated there are a lot of kids in the . . ':. fo : (4) lane highway that close is very
dangerous. He stated he does not be a Council Engineer is giving the resident's
enough credit relating to winter d • =. ted the options should be voted on and
rejected. He stated the City do s . ee Fore traffic on Hodgson. He stated the
County should take the mo ake 35 a six (6) lane highway.
Mr. Arnie Entzil, 663
present listening and c
residents know that im
highway coming to an a
Pelic '1. ce, noted that State Representative Mr. Vandaveer is
help. He stated he would like to make it clear that
ve ents are needed. He stated a two (2) mile stretch of
pt halt seems ridiculous. Channeling four (4) lanes into two
(2) lanes will back traffic up to Lake Drive. The road does need lights, a wider bridge
and turn out lanes. Those items will eliminate a lot of problems. The County Engineer
saying that widening the road at Blue Heron will not impact his property is ridiculous.
The County knows there will be an impact. He asked that the Council consider all
comments and taxpayers when voting on this project.
Ms. Judy Bartels, 247 Baldwin Circle, stated she does not see any proposals on how
traffic will get out of the trailer park. She asked how residents are supposed to get to
work. She stated she was just in Boston and they have no left turn lanes with four (4)
lane highways. She stated there are no options for other streets either. She stated the
residents are taxpayers and a petition was brought forward. She inquired about what
happened with the petition keeping in mind that this is a Charter City. She stated the
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
petition should mean something. She stated the residents do not want this road. The
County should fix the bridge and put in lights.
Mr. Dan Lahlum, 6828 Sunrise Drive, came forward and stated the project does not affect
him now but it will. He asked if anyone knows how much stretch of the road that
Ramsey County has. He stated Ramsey County probably has five (5) times more than
Anoka County. Ramsey County should be dealing with this problem before Anoka
County. He inquired about the way Ramsey County is avoiding this. He asked how he
would cross Lake Drive to Highway 49. He stated this will be a huge problem for
snowmobiles. The road will bring in more pollution and noise. He stated he will want to
have his house filtered and sound proofed because it will affect him and his family. He
stated he already has enough pollution on his property from Lake Drive. He stated he can
not afford to move. He stated he does not want the roadway to be a detour to 694. He
stated the County Engineer is being very heavy handed by saying the project will be all or
nothing.
Ms. Madonna Hughes, resident of Lino Lakes, came forwar
have bought a townhouse in the area if she had known ab
residents voted the Council in because residents believ d
stated she can hear the freeway now when her windows
doesn't understand how the project has gotten thi
Mr. Jim Anderson, resident of Shoreview, 5
that he sees the Council as being very u
sees a lot of room for compromise a
both Counties. He stated emotio
project calls for about 500-180
cause a "dumbbell" affect.
together to work on this i
to go down to 694 wi
he never would
he stated the
be trusted. She
She indicated she
gal Drive, came forward and stated
and compassionate. He stated he
wo (2) cities can work together with
ution; common sense is. He stated the
sition between the two (2) cities. This would
everyone involved should get an association
the current proposal. He noted the County wants
Mayor Bergeson thank all esidents for attending the meeting and making comments.
He noted there will be s - '- ral more meetings.
Mr. Robert Bening, 6788 Shadow Lake Drive, came forward and stated he moved into a
residential area of the City. He stated he know Hodgson was a highway and he is in
support of the project. He advised that all neighbors should be considered.
Council Member Carlson stated she is concerned about her neighbors. She stated she has
been to a lot of meetings and has heard a lot of talk relating to this project. She stated the
City needs to give the County a strong direction. She stated she would like to keep the
options open to work together. She stated action needs to be taken on the current
proposal from the County. She indicated she would like to poll the Council Members
regarding a vote on the options. She stated residents need to have a decision made.
12
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Council Member Reinert stated he would like to see other options from the County. He
stated if the current options are the only options, he is ready to take a vote. He stated he
would like to have a collected effort from the two (2) Counties and cities to improve the
roadway.
Council Member Dahl stated she is in support of a vote. She stated she also supports the
Council Members in Shoreview. She stated this issue is a symptom of a larger problem.
The major highways need to add lanes. The Metropolitan Council and the State need to
work together. Everyone needs to think beyond today. She noted County Road J to
Blaine is a four (4) lane highway because it had to be done that way. The roadway is now
a ghost lane. More traffic at 50 m.p.h. does not equal more safety. The project may
aleviate some problems on other roads. She stated that she believes there is a
compromise. She stated putting off the vote will not be beneficial. A vote should be
taken so the City can move forward.
Mayor Bergeson stated it is clear the majority of the Council w
He stated he believes it may be premature. He stated he ap
Counties and cities working together, however, does not
November 27, 2000.
with this issue.
gestion of the
happen before
This item will appear on the regular Council age , November 27, 2000, 6:30
p.m.
Mayor Bergeson called for a short bre
Mayor Bergeson reconvened the
TOWN CENTER UPDA ;Y ALICE DIVINE
p.
The Community Dev
development proposal
very preliminary. Staf
at the next Council wor
ector advised Dellwood, LLC, is putting together a
bein site in the Town Center. He noted the proposal is
s et with the developer and a video presentation will be made
ession. He referred to a map indicating the location of the site
and reviewed a timeline regarding the project. He noted the critical issue is the road.
The City Engineer advised a traffic impact study will be conducted from 77th Street down
to Lake Drive. The developer is sharing in the cost of the study.
The Economic Development Assistant advised direction is needed from Council. She
referred to the Calthorpe Plan noting that the proposed development is a conventional
suburban development and has nothing to do with the design standards. The main street
character will be lost. The question is if the Council wants to hold to the same direction it
has been going for years, or go with the Conventional development with staff using the
design standards as a guide. Staff noted the Calthorpe plan will take longer to develop
than the conventional type development.
13
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Council Member Carlson inquired about any impact on the grant application. Staff
advised they do not believe the conventional development on the north side will have any
impact on the grant application, which was for The Village site
Mayor Bergeson advised he called the chair of the committee regarding the clarification
letter sent to the Metropolitan Council. He advised the committee that the letter is not an
indication of the City moving away from the project.
Mayor Bergeson continued stating the conventional development may be an opportunity
to get a particular retailer into the community. That opportunity does not come around
very often. He stated he feels the City should try to work with them.
Council Member Dahl asked if the developer will comply to some of the design
standards. Staff advised the design standards create something totally different from this
proposed concept plan. The design standards do not fit the project.;e core of a
Traditional Neighborhood Development will be gone.
Council Member O'Donnell inquired about the opportun' to ot x`ay with the design
standards in the southern quadrant.
The City Engineer advised the City does not hav design standards. Staff needs
specific direction that the design standards w . •ply '• the northern quadrant.
The Economic Development Assistant 'ng the design standards a zoning
ordinance will resolve that issue.
Mayor Bergeson stated there ar • #2) t gs that are different in the southern quadrant:
if the grant is received and c : t the City owns most of the land.
Council Member D
Community Develop
suggested the City look
developer has requested the use of TIF. The
or stated the developer has not yet requested TIF. He
e possibility of utilizing TIF.
Council Member Reinert stated the City should pursue this developer. The standards can
be kept in place in the southern quadrant.
Council Member Carlson expressed concern regarding residents, truck traffic and
accesses.
The Community Development Director advised a neighborhood meeting should be held.
A buffer would have to be provided. Those issues will have to be addressed.
The City Engineer advised staff is exploring the possibility of closing 77th Street and
making it a cul-de-sac. That issue will be reviewed after the traffic study is completed.
14
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Council Member Carlson stated the user would be a business that will be an asset to the
community. She expressed concern regarding moving away from the standards entirely.
She stated the 20/20 Vision indicated the residents don't want a conventional shopping
center. She stated she does not want the project to cost citizens money. The developer
should be doing something because they will not have to abide by the standards. She also
expressed concern regarding the type of businesses that will go in.
Council Member O'Donnell indicated he is in favor of moving forward with the project
and stick with the architectural standards as much as possible. He asked if the City
should be proactive with the property owners to the south and let them know what
direction the City is taking.
Staff advised they have talked to Ehlers about redevelopment and TIF.
Council Member Carlson expressed concern regarding the City bu out properties.
Council Member Dahl stated she would like to keep negotia ' n"` - he asked "is it
possible to get the same look with the design standards?" h tat= e would like staff
to move forward with the project.
Mayor Bergeson stated the City would still have rage so it can ask them for part
of the design standards that are applicable. F
uld like to move forward also.
Staff noted the user is looking at an alter to ° . '. Therefore, timing will be an issue.
Council directed staff to proceed Ptual development plans keeping the
vision of the site in mind.
WEST SHADOW PON LOCATION, JEFF SMYSER
Staff distributed a me •` ng the Council discussion of the West Shadow ponds
project at the Septembe ; w.rk session. The City Council agreed that the extension of
West Shadow Lake Driv hould be extended to the 62nd Street right-of-way with a
barricade constructed. Removing the barricade to allow the new road connection to 62nd
Street will be determined in the future.
Several of the Council Members expressed concern over the trail location and preferred
that it be moved into the drainage easement. At the time, it seemed feasible. Staff
received a letter from the developer stating that further analysis reveals that moving the
trail to the easement would require additional wetland fill. This is undesirable from both
an environmental and a regulatory perspective.
The trail as proposed does provide for connection to a longer trail. It creates a nice loop
using Fox Road. The developer proposes screening and landscaping options to provide
privacy for existing lots in Birchwood Acres. This was anticipated in the creation of the
15
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
trail corridor. To accommodate screening, the corridor was made 30 feet wide instead of
the standard 15'.
Staff advised this issue has been discussed with Mr. DeGardner, Director of Public
Services. He concluded that the trail should be included and should be in its proposed
location. Staff referred to a drawing that shows that moving the trail one lot would
require crossing (and filling) additional wetland. Staff also referred to a plan for
Birchwood Park that shows the planned trails.
Council Member Reinert asked when the park will be developed. Staff advised the actual
time table is unknown. It is intended that the trail will be paved right away.
Council Member O'Donnell asked if the alternatives outlined have been shown to the
homeowners.
Mr. Rick Carlson, developer, came forward and stated he has
homeowners. At the last meeting it was requested that the t
will not work. He stated he will be requesting plat appro
also an option to take the trail out.
Council Member Dahl inquired about the type of
ed to the
. That option
er. He stated it is
Mr. Carlson advised he has offered to pay f•`some .e of fencing. He suggested a
better quality screening than Pine trees. ,• e� ed on the wetland issue and the
comments from the Rice Creek W at;.,� istrict
Council Member Reinert state es s,"se to talk to the residents about what type of
buffer they want.
Council directed Mr. arlson peak to the residents about the buffer. Mr. Carlson will
be present at the next
on to discuss the neighbors comments.
Council Member Carlson eferred to the first page of the memo. She expressed concern
relating to the statement that the Council agreed about the extension and how it relates to
the larger issues of the road. She stated she was not present at that meeting. She asked
how many votes will be needed to pass the project. Staff advised a 4/5 vote will be
needed.
The City Engineer advised the roadway would have a turn around constructed with
barricades. In the future the barricades will be taken down.
Council Member Carlson expressed concern regarding the language used in the memo.
She stated the compromise was to bring the residents in to help make a decision. She
stated she very clearly wants to support the developer and the residents. The residents
16
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
should have been involved in the decision. She advised she cannot guarantee she will
vote in support of the project.
Council directed staff to put this issue on a future work session agenda. Residents should
be contacted about the meeting date.
Council Member Dahl requested Mr. Carlson be very specific with residents about what
type of fencing and screening is acceptable.
NORTHWEST SADDLE CLUB, DONNA CARLSON
Council Member Carlson distributed information regarding the Northwest Saddle Club to
Council Members. She stated her main concern relates to the Comprehensive Plan. She
stated this plan has very small lots with 2% units per acre. She stated the Council needs
to consider what this will mean to the Comprehensive Plan.
The City Planner advised the project has not yet been submi
through the concept stage. The developer has been told t
MUSA. The Planning and Zoning Board has indicate
density. Staff noted this is not a cluster developme A t.
is going
land is not in the
comfortable with the
The developer for the Northwest Saddle Clu orwand indicated the total
acreage noted on the conceptual plan does n inclu= the extra land near Killdeer Drive.
Mayor Bergeson stated there are two: ues •ne is that the Comprehensive Plan in
its current form does not contement in this area in the near future. There
is also a design issue. This dog • eet ? e current or proposed zoning.
The City Planner advisede of the sites staff has asked be reviewed before
approval of the Com•ehensi
Council Member Carlssta ed she is not opposed to this coming through the process.
She stated the area will d MUSA. She referred to option A and commented on
conservation development. She stated there are issues that have to be addressed as the
Council goes through to the next Comprehensive Plan meeting. She stated she would
have a hard time approving small lots without seeing what the City is getting in return.
The developer stated those issues were apparent at the Planning and Zoning Board
meeting this evening. He stated he is still working on the plan. At this point the plan is
conceptual.
Council Member Carlson stated the City already has an excess of residential acreage in
2010 MUSA line. The City would need a good reason to add more.
17
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
RESOLUTION 00 —105 ELECTING TO CONTINUE PARTICIPATION IN THE
LIVABLE COMMUNITIES PROGRAM, JEFF SMYSER
Staff advised the City must continue to participate in the Livable Communities Program
or the City will not be eligible for the grant. Staff noted the goals have not changed.
This item will appear on the regular Council agenda Monday, November 13, 2000, 6:30
p.m.
CLEARWATER CREEK BUSINESS CENTER — AMENDING CONDITIONS OF
PLAT APPROVAL, JEFF SMYSER
Staff advised the preliminary plat for the Clearwater Creek Business Center was approved
by the City December 15, 1997. The approval of the Dairy Queen site plan includes the
condition that the final plat must be completed.
Standard City policy for final plat approval requires that the
be met. There were 11 conditions approved with the pre
conditions #7 and #10 relating to floodplain issues.
f approval must
Staff referred to
Staff advised these conditions have not been met r, t e floodplain map has been
revised for areas around the Dairy Queen site eder Emergency Management
Agency (FEMA) has requested a new Letter E ' evision (LOMR) application
including additional technical informa b her revising the Flood Insurance
Rate Map (FIRM) in this area. Bec Dairy Queen is awaiting final plat approval,
staff recommends amending the ct pproval as follows:
Delete preliminary plat cones,, d 10 that were approved December 15, 1997 and
replace them with the fol ion:
Within one ye lat approval, the City of Lino Lakes will prepare and
submit a LOM' ppl:tion to redefine the Zone A area located at the southeast
corner of Main S - et/21st Avenue. This generally includes the area to be
occupied by the proposed Dairy Queen and the existing Amoco. All costs related
to this work will be charged against the trunk credits for the Clearwater Creek
Business Center.
This item will appear on the regular Council agenda Monday, November 13, 2000, 6:30
p.m.
FINAL PLAT — CLEARWATER CREEK BUSINESS CENTER, JEFF SMYSER
Staff advised the preliminary plat for the Clearwater Creek Business Center was approved
by the City in December, 1997. Staff briefly reviewed their analysis of the final plat
18
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
noting the conditions of approval will be satisfied if the change recommended in the
previous agenda item is approved.
Staff advised Council approve the final plat assuming all items are satisfied by meeting
time.
This item will appear on the regular Council agenda Monday, November 13, 2000, 6:30
p.m.
BEHM'S PARK RESIDENTIAL LOTS, JEFF SMYSER
Staff advised Gary Uhde of G. M. Development has requested that the City allow him to
follow through on his plan for development of a portion of what is now Behm's Park.
Staff is requesting Council direction.
In 1999, the Council authorized selling 2.55 acres of the park t
$75,000, which was to include the improvements to the par
Resolution 99 — 50). The intent was to allow for the cre
However, there was no guarantee that the City would
the 2.55 acres.
Staff summarized the history noting that Be
8.6 acres. The park area includes Lots 13, 1
City acquired these four (4) lots for par
Apparently, the requirement that the
agreement of those who dedicate
evelopment for
16 — 99 and
) house lots.
mg or development of
cu ntly includes approximately
16, Block 2, Sunset Oaks. The
warranty deed in December 1985.
purposes was amended with the
art of the 1999 actions described above.
The City rezoned Lots 14, , 3, ' -1 in 1994 (Ordinance 15 — 94). Lot 13, the
southern portion of the p not ' cluded in the rezoning action. Staff advised it is
unclear as to why this of was, uded from the rezoning.
In 1997, the City receive ap roval from the Metropolitan Council to allow the City to
use part of its MUSA re e for the Behm's Century Farms development. The approved
submittal map did not include Lot 13. That is, the southern part of Behm's Park was not
included in the area where MUSA can be applied. Staff advised it is unclear why this lot
was not included in the City's submittal.
In order to provide for following through on the 1999 actions, three (3) actions would be
needed:
1. Rezone Lot 13 Sunset Oaks to R-1.
2. Allocate 2.55 acres of MUSA reserve to the area to be sold to the
developer. This would include approximately 0.52 acres outside of the
area approved for MUSA.
3. Preliminary plat, with normal plat submittal from the developer.
19
CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION NOVEMBER 8, 2000
Council Member Carlson stated the actions include allocating 2.55 acres of MUSA to
what looks like a very small area. Staff advised MUSA is needed for all the new lots.
Council directed staff to proceed with the staff recommendation and necessary actions.
COMPREHENSIVE PLAN UPDATE, DAN TESCH
Mayor Bergeson advised the next Comprehensive Plan work session will be Wednesday,
November 15, 2000.
REGULAR AGENDA, NOVEMBER 13, 2000
There were no changes to the regular agenda.
Council Member Carlson reminded Council Members to bring co
minutes to the Monday meeting. She added she received a lett
Acres.
The City Engineer advised that issue will be discusse
Council Member Carlson inquired about the Par
Council gave staff direction regarding that is
will make copies of her notes for Council
The City Planner advised staff is ex
proposal is to perform a study re
Mayor Bergeson stated the
the old City Hall for $1.0
the reader board.
of the meeting
g Twilight
on Pee. She stated she believes
stag's she called other cities and
d staff.
a proposal from Mr. Brixius very soon. The
ue.
has requested to purchase the reader board sign at
geson directed staff to inquire about the status of
The meeting was adjou ed al 11:35 p.m.
These minutes were considered, corrected and approved at the regular Council meeting held on
November 13, 2000.
illazhatact
Ry-Chel Gaustad, City Clerk
4IP
John r>-rge sn, Mor
Transcribed by:
Kim Points, TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc.
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