HomeMy WebLinkAbout8-20-07 Park Minutes FinalAPPROVED 9-17-07
Lake Elmo Park Commission
Minutes of the Regular Meeting
August 20, 2007
Chairman Steele called to order the meeting of the Lake Elmo Parks Commission at 7:00
p.m. COMMISSIONERS PRESENT: Steele, Booher, Blackford, Larson, Ames, T.
Bouthilet, Dunn, and Bruchu. STAFF PRESENT: Planner Matzek and Public Works
Superintendent M. Bouthilet.
Approval of Agenda
Chairman Steele added the following items to the agenda:
10A – “Lions Park pollution abatement project”
M/S/P, Dunn/Ames to approve the agenda as amended. Vote: 7:0.
Commissioner Bruchu arrived at 7:03 p.m.
Approval of Minutes
July 16, 2007
Commissioner Blackford said on page four, two thirds of the way down the page, she
would like to add that the Park Commission spent three years discussing mountain bikes
and there is an ordinance in place. It should be added where the thick file is mentioned.
She would like it clarified it was the first time she was on the commission.
Chairman Steele would like the year Commissioner Blackford joined the commission the
first time.
Commissioner Blackford would like the minutes to reflect that an official vote was not
taken on including the word “bicycle” in the Sunfish Lake Park report.
Commissioner Booher on page five would like to see “but” replaced with “and.”
Commissioner Dunn said she would like it in the minutes on page five to show that
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet was not aware that the water was not working
and that he was glad to be made aware.
M/S/P, Booher/Larson to approve the minutes as amended. Vote: 8:0.
Draft Park Plan
Chairman Steele asked that this item be postponed until later in the meeting.
Lake Elmo Arts Center – Clarification of building status and Park Commission
responsibilities
Chairman Steele said that the land and building where the Lake Elmo Regional Arts
Center is located was bought with park funds. The Arts Center has a lease for the site
until 2011.
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Commissioner Dunn commented that the park principles talk about natural areas and she
thought the house and land was purchased to conceptually be a part of Lions Park.
Commissioner Ames said he would like to work with the City Council in the future on
the potential use of this site.
Park Partners
Commissioner Dunn said she visited Carriage Station Park and there is one dead pine tree
and one looks sickly. The equipment looks to be in good shape. She thanks Public
Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet for getting the woodchips in at Lions Park.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said he plans to replace the dead tree this fall.
Commissioner Booher said there was quite a bit of growth in the field at Stonegate Park.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said that games were not played on the field,
so they quit grooming it for the fall.
Commissioner Larson and T. Bouthilet both would like to look at Reid Park.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said it had been cleaned up.
Reports – Sunfish Lake Park Uses – Draft Report
Chairman Steele asked that this item be discussed later in the meeting.
Area West of Sunfish Lake Park
Planner Matzek said at this time, there is no update.
Park CIP Discussion (Part 1)
Chairman Steele asked that this item be discussed later in the meeting.
Heights Park Update
Planner Matzek said the city has recently hired a part time person who will be working
with the parks in the future. She said it is her understanding she will undertake projects
such as Heights Park and the trail along Klondike Avenue.
Klondike Trail Update
Planner Matzek said she expects the new part time employee to undertake this type of
project.
10A Lions Park pollution abatement project
Chairman Steele said he and Commissioner Bruchu were at a meeting with engineers to
hear about the treatment of contaminated water at the Hagberg Market site.
Commissioner Bruchu said the MPCA has studied the contamination and found it
originates at the Hagberg site. They would like to dig deep holes and put in perforated
pipes and a drainfield system underground. The water will be pumped out at 100 gallons
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per minutes. It would be cleaned and put back into the groundwater and should not affect
the surface water.
Chairman Steele said the Hagberg site used to be an auto shop, which is where the
contamination originated. The whole plume was polluted with just ten barrels. The
trenches are planned to be placed along the third baseline of VFW park.
Planner Matzek said the PCA will come speak to the commission in the future.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said he suggested the water be used for
irrigation at VFW and Lions parks. The city may be able to sell the water to nurseries
and not have to use the drinkable water.
Commissioner Blackford said the plume from the landfill changed direction after they
started the effluent spray.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said there are concerns with noise from the
treatment. The treatment building would be approximately 14 feet by 20 feet and 12 feet
tall. The city said the noise could not be louder than 50 db.
Commissioner Ames suggested the water could be used for a fountain at a city gathering
space.
#8 Park CIP Discussion A
Chairman Steele said he would like to be proactive in the approach to the planning for the
parks. It was suggested by the City Administrator to identify priority parks and to work
with the neighborhoods. He said it would be helpful to work with the appropriate
neighborhoods in creating the CIP.
Commissioner Ames asked how this would address trails.
Commissioner Larson said the process sounds like a lot of work.
Chairman Steele said the vast majority of the work would be done by the new part time
city employee Carol Kriegler. It may be as easy as one meeting a year. He is hoping for
a partnership between the commission, staff, and the neighborhoods.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said that the work would be done in
developing parks, not redevelopment of existing parks.
Chairman Steele said the process would involve bringing neighborhoods together and
discussing ideas for future years. He said maybe two or three parks could be addressed a
year. A CIP still needs to be developed each year.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said that depending on the size, some
maintenance items do not go through the CIP process.
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Commissioner Ames suggested the commission proactively identify priority trail
segments.
Commissioner Bruchu asked if trails counted towards park dedication in developments.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said it did.
#8 CIP Discussion B
Chairman Steele said the commission had allocated approximately $251,000 to be spent
this year, but only $12,134 has been spent. He asked Public Works Superintendent M.
Bouthilet which projects had not yet been done.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said that he had been talking to the
manufacturer regarding the merry-go-round due to liability issues. The tennis court
resurfacing could be moved out to 2008. Extending the parking lot in Reid might still
happen. He said Carol Kriegler may play a part in the item for Sanctuary. The work in
Tablyn Park might not be done, but it is dependent on the contractor bids. He received
pricing for the drinking fountain at the VFW Park, but is holding off on the project. It
may be a timing issue with the pipes the PCA might install.
Commissioner Bruchu said a net would be beneficial at VFW park, he would still like to
see it pursued and will come back with a recommendation in the future on location.
Commissioner Ames said he sees the parking area being maximized during the winter
and there are some pretty substantial potholes.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said their department is considering renting a
paver to do the work themselves.
Chairman Steele asked the commissioners to think about the items for the CIP and the
item can be brought back in September or October for further discussion.
M/S/P, Dunn/Ames to continue the CIP discussion at a future meeting. Votes: 8:0.
#3 Draft Park Plan
Chairman Steele said he made only cosmetic fixes to the document. He asked that the
discussion be on the substantive issues that need to be changed and that additional
grammar and punctuation changes to send those to staff.
Commissioner Booher asked if the city is look to have an active future community park.
Commissioner Larson said there may be one included in the village area.
Commissioner Booher asked if tennis courts would be included in the sports complex.
He would like to see the picture of the Lake Elmo School on page 3-4 removed as it is
not reference.
Commissioner Dunn said she will email text for addition to page 2-8.
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Commissioner Blackford said she would like to see those wording changes added back
into the plan that were previously approved by motions such as “quiet/solitude” on page
2-8 and 2-2.
Commissioner Booher asked that a description be added by staff to the diagram on page
3-11.
Commissioner Dunn said she would like to see the regional park continue to be referred
to as a Regional Park Reserve.
Chairman Steele suggested on page 3-13 to change the last bullet from “Preserve” to
“Reserve.”
Commission Larson suggested a fourth bullet saying that “Lake Elmo will work to
develop links with the Park Reserve to discuss points of common interest and to work on
projects in a joint manner.”
M/S/Withdrawn, Larson/Booher to approve the addition of the language identified above.
No vote was taken. Commissioner Larson withdrew his motion.
Commissioner Larson suggested the following language to be added to page 3-13, “The
city will seek to collaborate with Washington County to discuss points of common
interest and to work on projects in a joint manner relating to the Lake Elmo Park Reserve
and Lake Elmo’s parks.”
M/S/P, Larson/Booher, to approve the addition of the language as identified above.
Discussion occurred.
Commissioner Blackford said she is concerned the previous city staff had talked with the
County to potentially trade city and county owned land. She said she does not trust the
County as they get heavy-handed with the Lake Elmo Regional Park Reserve. She had
attended a meeting in Woodbury where a County official made a comment about the
transaction having occurred. She does not want to have language included in the report
that would commit the city to anything.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said that it had not occurred and it was not
planned to occur. He said the official may have spoke out of turn.
Vote 6:2.
Commissioner Blackford voted against because Washington County is heavy-handed
with what they wanted to do with the city’s parks.
Commissioner Dunn voted against because she thinks city parks are city parks. She said
the city is already involved in the system and the city does not need to go looking for it.
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Commissioner Bruchu said he would like to add the words “full sized” on page 2-10 and
that the park is predominantly used by organized youth ball programs. He asked that
lighted tennis courts be removed from the list on page 2-10, but batting cages should be
added.
M/S/P, Ames/Booher to approve the Park Plan with changes made at the meeting and any
pending final edits coming from the commission and assuming no changes are made to
the maps. Vote: 8:0.
Commissioner Blackford requested copies of the Park Plan after it is approved and copies
of the already approved Comprehensive Trail Plan.
Sunfish Lake Park Report
Chairman Steele said at previous meetings, the commission had gone through page eight
of the document. He would like their recommendation separated from the staff report
and shown as two different documents. He said on page eight, within Area One, point
two, there was previously discussed the issue of bicycles. He asked Commissioner
Blackford to give a historical background on how the issue of bicycles was brought in
previously.
Commissioner Blackford said the item had been worked on previously by the park
commission. An ordinance was put into place in 1992. In 1994, the park commission
asked the council to specifically enforce the ordinance at Sunfish Lake Park. She said a
document signed unanimously by the commissioners at the time, letters from other
agencies, a DNR letter regarding the nature conservancy, letters from residents, and
letters from the Sierra Club were provided to the Council. The City Council made a
recommendation accepting the document in 1994 that passed 5:0. The Comprehensive
Trail Plan document from November 2005 says on page 31 that there will be no biking
within the park. See attached document.
Chairman Steele said biking has not been allowed in the park since 1994.
Commissioner Blackford said the language in the draft report should stay in there.
Commissioner T. Bouthilet said on the staff report that the words “recommending
unanimously” were added, but it is not being recommended unanimously.
Chairman Steele said if the commission can not come to an agreement, then that wording
will be changed.
Commissioner Ames said he does not hear any suggestions that bicycles be allowed at
this time or in the near future. He said he would like to be careful in putting things down
as forever. A good example is looking at how the suggested needs for parks have
changed since the 1990 Comprehensive Plan.
Commission T. Bouthilet said future park commissions might want something different.
He said he does not want something that absolute. He said he would be comfortable with
no expansions of trails in the future. Bicycles are already not allowed by ordinance.
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Park Commission Minutes; August 20, 2007 7
Commissioner Blackford said she would like to see a sentence saying that currently
bicycles are not allowed.
Chairman Steele said the language would not allow expansion of the usage from what is
allowed today.
Commissioner Ames said he is not looking to leave a loophole in the future. He said the
commission needs to be judicious about what they are including.
Chairman Steele asked the commission if the year 2007 should be included as the date
from which the allowed uses would maintained.
Commissioner Blackford suggested a motion on part two, that there shall be no expansion
of uses within Sunfish Lake Park.
M/S/Withdrawn, Rolf/ Dunn to recommend there shall be no expansion of uses within
Sunfish Lake Park.
Public Works Superintendent M. Bouthilet said he thinks it is too broad. He said he
thinks a clear distinction should be made for mountain biking and other uses.
Commissioner T. Bouthilet asked that the discussion be tabled until the next meeting.
Commissioner Blackford retracted her motion.
Adjourn
M/S/P, T. Bouthilet/Booher to adjourn at 9:13 p.m. Vote: 8:0.
Respectfully submitted,
Kelli Matzek
Planner