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LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES
MARCH 17, 1987
Mayor Christ called the City Council meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. in
the .Lake Elmo Elementary School.. Present: Christ, Armstrong, Graves,
Moe, Johnson, City Engineer Bohrer, City Planner Rob Chelseth, City
Attorney Knaak and City Administrator Overby.
1. Agenda
M/S/P Graves/Armstrong - to approve the agenda for the March 17, 1987
City Council meeting as presented. (Motion carried 5-0).
2. Minutes: March 3, 1987
M/S/P Johnson/Graves - to approve the
minutes as amended (See 6B. Lake Elmo
Legion Pond). (Motion carried 5-0).
3. Claims
March 3, 1987 City Council
IIeights 2nd Addition and 7B.
M/S/P Graves/Armstrong - to approve the March 17, 1987 City Council
claims #88531 thru #88584 (Claim #88584 was added for
$194.89---expenses related to landfill project).
City Administrator Overby reported that $379 has been spent by the
citizen's committee to address the landfill. Citizens Committee
Co-ordinator Dan Novak did not realize the expenditures were that high
and asked if the spending limit could be increased to a total of $500.
M/S/P Graves/Johnson - to approve increasing the spending limit from
$250 to $500 for the citizens committee to addresss the landfill.
(Motion carried 5-0).
4. PLANNING.LAND USE AND ZONING
A. Planned Unit Development General Concept Plan:
Interstate Freeway Service Centeer, Co. 15 & I-94;
Erickson Diversified Corporation
Representatives from the Erickson Diversified Corporation made their
presentation to the City Council on March 3, 1987. The City Council
decided to table the agenda item to the following Council meeting in
order to allow time for the public to speak for or against the project
concept plan.
M/S/P Johnson/Graves - to remove from the table the Planned Unit
Development General Concept Plan: Interstate Freeway Service Center,
Co. 15 & I-94; Erickson Diversified Corporation. (Motion carried
5-0).
Mr. Gregory Erickson, General Counsel for Erickson Diversified gave a
brief summary of their proposal. Mayor Christ consented to
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 2
Development Attorney Larry Berg's request for time to address any
questions that may be expressed.
The following comments were taken from the public:
Hans Stockstead, real estate broker in Stillwater, expressed the
adjacent landowners' view because they would be the most directly
affected by this. They believe the proposal is an excellent plan, a
completely self-contained area that would be a good service to
everybody and would not affect other areas of the City. On behalf of
the adjacent landowners, Stockstead added, they have no objections and
would recommend that the City Council work with Erickson Diversiified
to support them in their endeavor to proceed with their plan.
Jess Mottaz, 8770 DeMontreville Tr., felt the presented concept plan
fits the Land Use Management Plan of the 1979 Comprehensive Plan very
well. This plan calls for highway commercial development along this
strip. The proposed 1986 Comprehensive Plan has yet to be acted upon
by the Metropolitan Council. This is scheduled for their April 23,
1987 meeting. If it is approved, this will be the comprehensive plan
in force in Lake Elmo. Until that time, the 1979 Comprehensive Plan
is in effect. If the City approves this concept, they would be
telling other developers that the City of Lake Elmo wants
long-lasting, high quality, development and not a long strip of pole
barns, retail storage or another drive-in theater. He also thought
that if the City approves this plan, it is possible that the Erickson
Co. might be receptive to suggestions and ideas put forth by the City
of Lake Elmo that might go beyond the code requirements. Mottaz urges
the Council to approve the concept plan.
Gene Peltier introduced himself as one of the surviving 8 or 9 farmers
that there is left in Lake Elmo. People who travel I-94 desperately
need a service station facility and the Peltiers have been filling
this void for many years. He has lost count of the number of people
that come to his farm for gas, jacks or to use his phone. He
especially gets upset when they pound on his door in the middle of the
night. We have more cropland than we can utilize which he can attest
to because he has corn on his farm since 1984, 1985 and 1986. Lake
Elmo is going contrary to the Federal Government by favoring
agricultural production and we cetainly don't need it. Lake Elmo has
reached a point where we no longer can afford so-called "rural
atmosphere". As the tax rates have been increasing the last three
years, it is about time we do an about face and plan for new tax
revenue for the future. Parks don't pay taxes and we have enough of
them. Peltier can no longer can afford this "rural atmosphere". Lake
Elmo needs a financial opportunity offered by Erickson Diversified and
he heartily endorses this new project.
Bruce Dunn, 11018 Upper 33rd St., commented on Erickson's projected
revenue. While these figures cannot be disputed, the money is going to
come in. It is the same sales pitch that is used in most every other
City when there is a proposed developement to be considered. In the
cities that have promoted developments, the assessed evaluations have
gone up, and the mill rates have gone up correspondingly. Examples
given:
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987
Woodbury
Oakdale
Stillwater
Maplewood
Lake Elmo
Minneapolis
St Paul
Assessed Evaluations
$117 million
$ 68 million
$ 76 million
$268 million
$ 35 million
$ 3 billion
$1.8 billion
PAGE 3
Mill Rate
18.4
27.5
28
17.7
12.5
34.7
32.9
So when we consider these projects, Dunn felt we should consider them
not in respect to revenue that will be generated, but whether they fit
in the Comprehensive Plan of the City.
Dave Morgan, 11150 20th St Ct, urged the Council to not approve this
concept plan for the following reasons: It is not within our
metropolitan urban service area, it is not in agreement with our
comprehensive plan, it is not in agreement with our land use plan and
this area was not scheduled to be developed until the next decade. If
this project is approved you really lose control over the rest of the
strip. He could not think of anything that would have a greater
impact in this area than a truck stop. A few months ago, the City
Council was under vehement criticism of the 201 Program to restore
onsite systems (1-3 bedroom homes) which were properly engineered.
Now today it is acceptable to put an onsite system for 125 bed motel,
200+ seat restaurant, fast food place and service station. So the
people that support this were either wrong before or are wrong now.
The highest cost to run municipal government in this state is
Minneapolis and St. Paul. They have the tax base, but the need for
services outspend the revenue that development has brought in. There
is no development that doesn't eventually need service of some kind.
Morgan added, that he has been on the other side of the table for ten
years. In those ten years, only two significant developments had been
proposed. One for a railroad unloading facility and another one for a
car dealership. The one thing they had in common was they were out in
the country, had cornfields and asked for rezoning because the land is
much cheaper there than in the section that is sewered. In those ten
years, not one bonifide request came for development in Section 32.
This same proposal was rejected by the City of Woodbury twice. It
never got past the Planning Commission in Afton. It was never
officially brought up in West Lakeland, but unofficially, a feeler was
put out and was not met with any encouragement. The reasons stated by
the Woodbury City Council were the very same reasons Morgan stated.
Based on the precedent by the City of Woodbury and Afton, Morgan urged
the council to deny this proposal not only for the people of Lake
Elmo, but for the neighbors in every corner that discouraged this
proposal.
Wyn John, 8883 Jane Road N., had a concern on the environmental impact
of having a truck stop in this area which leaves the place liable to
spills of various liquids they may be carrying which collect in
ponding areas that are on the site. His question to Erickson is "how
are you going to deal with the environment problem that will
eventually occur to prevent spillages going down and ending up in the
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 4
St Croix River?"
Mary Leslie, 11546 20th Street, voiced concerns on the location of the
project. If it was located in the sewered area of Section 32, she
would not have most of her concerns. This proposed location is where
the off -ramp is for Lake Elmo and during rush hours there is alot of
traffic that comes off this ramp. Other concerns are prostitution at
truck stops, unsafe trucks, truck drivers are often under the
influence of alcohol or drugs and will be sharing this off -ramp with
US. Mr. Erickson stated he will run a clean operation, but gives no
guarantee of how long he will be owning this development. Other
concerns were the septic system, truck noise, and the potential impact
on the students at Oakland Jr. High.
Steve DeLapp, Chairman of the Planning Commission, handed out
information to the City Council from the Metropolitan Council and a
letter from Barbara Senness, Senior Policy Planner of the Metropolitan
Council. Under the General Rural Use Area, which Lake Elmo is in,
this policy statement states the Metropolitan Council supports
long-term preservation of agricultural land in the general rural use
area. However, the Council will also support residential development
at densities of no more than one unit per 10 acres computed on a
40-acre basis (a maximum of four units per 40 acres). The Council
will not extend metropolitan systems to serve urban -density
residential development in the general rural use area. Where
urban -density development already exists, a local government should
address service issues in its plan, particularly on -site sewer system
operation and maintenance.
In a letter written to Mayor Christ, Barbara. Senness stated that
"non-residential development in the rural service area is appropriate
only in rural centers. (The old village in Lake Elmo is an example of
a rural center under the Council's definition). Consequently, the
Council would give a negative review to an amendment to allow a
non-residential development in Lake Elmo's rural service area if it
were outside the old village. The letter further states the need for
a permit by the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency (MPCA) for a State
Disposal System (SDS) permit for any rural non-residential development
in the state that would generate more than 15,000 gallons of
wastewater per day. DeLapp quoted "under an agreement with the MPCA,
if the Metropolitan Council indicates that the project is inconsistent
with Council policy, the MPCA will not approve the permit". Senness
stated that Lake Elmo should be aware that in its sewer policy plan,
the Council strongly states that the in situ local unit of government
bears the burden of insuring that local sewer facilities do not cause
a health or safety problem. The Council does not intend to provide
metropolitan sewer service in the rural service area and any necessary
remedial measures would be the city's responsibility.
Ed Stevens, was impressed by the reports and maps submitted by
Erickson Diversified Corporation, but has misgivings about the
proposal because it conflicts with the Comprehensive Plan. For this
reason, he joined with the unanimous vote of the Planning Commission
to reject this proposal. Another question was the adequacy of the
sewer system, so Mr. Stevens contacted Prof. Roger Machmeier at the
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 5
Univ. of MN who submitted a 6-page report listing his objections to
the proposal.
Lake Elmo has had experience with poor planning. In the old village
the houses were clustered too closely and now their septic systems are
malfunctioning and a costly new system must be installed. Building
permits are granted to build in flood plains and costly and disruptive
remedies are necessary to continue. A garbage dump in a former gravel
pit was to become a park or a golf course, but resulted in
contamination of groundwater and loss of residential values. With
this history, we should be skeptical of any large new development that
promises only benefits and no drawbacks and urged the City Council to
refuse the PUD application.
Mr. Stevens added that he has been a resident for approximately 26
years and does not like high taxes any more than anyone else does, but
the more industrialized the towns are, the higher the mill rate. The
people who are here applauding this truck stop have been sold a bill
of goods and in a few years the taxes will be higher than if they had
voted against it.
Dale Barns voiced social concerns such as the drug and prostitution
problem associated with a truckstop which would only be one-third of a
mile away from the school and questionned the cargo being carried. He
stated that in Tennessee, 20% of the truckers were found to have drug
substances.
Tim Mandel, 2479 Lisbon Avenue objected to the application because of
the location to Oakland Jr. High School. He felt anyone there would
rather have paid higher taxes and prevent something tragic that might
happen at the high school.
Todd Williams stated there are three factions in Lake Elmo; First:
represented by the developer who wants to develop land to the greatest
density because he wants the highest return on his investment; Second:
represented by the local business owner who wants dense development
because he wants more customers; Third: represented by the averge
homeowner who wants a nice place to live and is interested in having
low taxes and a good value for his home if he should want to sell it.
A knowledgable homeowner know that dense development always leads to
demand for services which outstrips the taxpayers. Williams presented
a graph of taxes and home values for 95 metropolitan communities that
the Citizens League had published. The Lake Elmo Comprehensive Plan
calls for intense land use to go into that area for which sewer is
already acceptable and does not prevent uses of people's land. It
merely allows uses which are in the best interest of the majority,
namely the homeowner. There are many ways to develop the land outside
of the MUSA line which meet the desires of both the business owner and
the homeowners. A truckstop is not one of these uses. Even if by
some miracle this development doesn't call for an increase in city
services, it will degrade the environment and will lead to other
developments which will lead to an untimely expansion of services and
expansion of the tax bill. Williams urged the Council to reject this
proposed development at this location.
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 6
Planning Commission Secretary Ann Bucheck urged the Council to look at
the Planning Commission's reason for denying the request by Erickson
Diversified. The reason being the proposal was not consistent with
the Lake Elmo Comprehensive Plan.
Planning Commission member Tom Simpson expressed a concern about
possible organic pollutants that would get into the groundwater table
in an area that does not have a benefit of city sewer service. This
might be another change of sewer having to be put out there before our
planning allows for it.
Planning Commission Vice Chairman Marge Williams opposed this proposal
because it was not consistent with the Comprehensive Plan. Williams
also cited police department reports indicating that prostitution
activity routinely shifts between St. Paul and Hudson. The City of
Lake Elmo, which has a population of 6,000, had zero complaints for
prostitution in 1986 and 1987. The proposed truckstop is near the
school and diagonally across from Cimarron. She could not believe
that any large development can promise no such activity no matter how
good the management policy is. According to the Washington County
Sheriff's Department any increase in development, no matter what type,
increases police calls. Williams added that any community that
increases its criminal statistics does not present itself as a good
place to live.
Mayor Christ acknowledged a letter written to the City Council by
Susan Wiesbrod, 11356 30th St. N., stating she is strongly opposed to
the proposed Erickson Interstate Service Center because of the bad
reputation that follows truck drivers and truck stops that have been
created by the truck driving community, building an adjacent motel
would invite prostitution, and being located close to a public school
where innocent children could be influenced or even solicited.
Public input was taken until 7:55 p.m.
Attorney Larry Berg felt the more factual information that can be
given about the project, the more palatable this would be to the
community. What is before the Council now is the decision on the
conceptual notion of whether there should be a development. If
conditional approval is given, they will go to the Planning Commission
where they will have an opportunity to prove that they will keep their
promises.
Berg added that this is not a very dense development. It is a 64 acre
site and the development will be done in three phases. The first
phase is what they are asking consent for and they cannot do Phase II
or Phase III without coming back to the City and go through the entire
process. They could prove to the Planning Commission then they have
adequate soils for what they want to do and concerns on pollution have
been addressed. Traffic studies show that at peak traffic periods
less than 30 cars or trucks are going to be heading north on Manning
Avenue in a given hour.
Under a Planned Unit Development there are agreements, contracts and
financial guarantees where the City is a partner of the development.
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 7
They are aware of the social concerns, have dealt with them, and will
be covered to the City's satisfaction. Because there is no extension
of municipal services, there is not going to be an increase in the
mill rate caused by this development. Their discussions with the
Metropolitan Council indcated they have some problems with their own
land use planning in that they recognize along a major metropolitan
facility that certain types of development are appropriate, that a
Feeway Service Center can only be on a freeway at a major interchange.
The Metropolitan Council's response was favorable as long as Erickson
can satisfy the applicable requirements for on -site systems, but to
not expect municipal services to be extended. This is the most
appropriate site which will have the least possible impact on this
community.
Larry Berg explained that this plan is not remotely similar to any
project that was brought to the City of Woodbury. They did not pursue
it in Afton because they did not have a Planned Unit Development
Ordinance. The soils in West Lakeland were not as good as the soils
on the site in Lake Elmo.
City Administrator Overby summarized the staff review of February 2nd
regarding the consistency of the project with the 1986 Comprehensive
Plan. The conclusion from the staff review which was adopted by the
Planning Commission stated: An exhaustive review of the 1986 Lake Elmo
Comprehensive Plan finds no support from either a policy or land. use
aspect for the proposed Erickson Planned Unit Development. The
location for the PUD is not in a place where the Lake Elmo community
would want this kind of development. The concept plan for the
Erickson PUD should be recommended for denial by the City Council as
being totally inconsistent with the 1986 Comprehensive Plan.
A staff review based on the 1979 Comprehensive Plan indicated that the
Erickson PUD is an urban scale development that is freeway oriented
and a highway commercial use that is also clearly not consistent with
the 1979 Plan goals and policies. For this reason, and other findings
of fact, the Erickson PUD concept plan should be denied by the City
Council.
City Administrator Overby presented a Findings of Fact on the Erickson
PUD from his Staff Review of March 16, 1987.
City Administrator Overby had asked City Assessor Frank Langer to
analyze the Erickson project in regard to Lake Elmo's tax base and the
metropolitan Fiscal Disparities Pool. The three basic conclusions
are:
1. Phase I of the Erickson project would allow the City to levy
$558,800 for its annual budget, based on a mill rate of
14.299 mills. For comparison sake, the City levied $543,054
for its 1987 budget, with a 14.299 mill rate.
2. If all 3 phases of the Erickson PUD were constructed as
proposed, the development would allow the City to levy
$625,200 at the 14.299 mill rate.
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 8
3. Phase I would contribute $65,366.88 in additional tax revenue.
Phases I -II -III would contribute $201,022.34 in additional
tax revenue.
A review was done in reference to the September 1986 Metropolitan
Development & Investment Framework guide. Overby summarized that the
Erickson project is located in the "Rural Service Area" of Lake Elmo.
The entire "focus of the Council's strategy on directing growth in the
region is to encourage development to occur within the urban service
area" which is Section 32 & 33 in Lake Elmo (west of Cty. Rd. 13 and
south of 10th Street). The goals of the MDIF are to "retain and
enhance the region's quality of life and promote its orderly and
economic development" Three goals specifically related to the
Erickson project are:
1. Locate all urban development and urban scale development
within a metropolitan urban service area.
2. Preserve agricultural and rural land use in a rural
service area.
3. Concentrate major commercial and industrial development.
FINDING: The proposed Erickson PUD Phase I concept plan is not
consistent with Metropolitan Council goals and policies, as contained
in its September 1986 Metropolitan Development and Investment
Framework.
John Bannigan, attorney for the landowners, commented that there would
be a highway patrol station three miles away so the trucks would be
safety inspected so this should not be a concern. Using Ray's Truck
Stop as an admirable example, this community should not be fearful of
bringing any type of lowlife or threats to the school and homes
because of this type of use. He is proud to support this proposal and
recommended consideration of the concept plan.
Councilwoman Armstrong stated that the main consideration is how this
project would fit with our comprehensive plans and the guidance
received from the Metropolitan Council. The 1979 Plan has requested
that development in this area along I-94 not be slated until after
1990 and the plan did not want development to be very far from the
MUSA Line which is the Southwestern corner of Lake Elmo.
As far as the 1986 Comprehensive Plan, the recommendation is for
development to occur in the southwestern corner where there is sewer
availability.
This proposal which is in the far end of the City were to fail and
require a sewer hookup, the sewer would have to run along the entire
length of I-94. There are concerns about the public health, safety,
and welfare of the community. The school is very close to the
proposed development and there are school buses travelling south over
I-94 which could be a serious problem. The Metropolitan Council has
cautioned the City that this type of proposal is not what they had in
mind for development in the eastern end of the Metro area because Lake
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 9
Elmo does not have the services for development this far out. There
have been five weeks to look at this proposal, the Planning Commission
turned down this proposal by a vote of 9-0, an hour presentation was
given at the last City Council meeting, and the City Council members'
phone numbers were advertised by Erickson in the newspaper to invite
the public for their input. With all this input, adequate information
has been given to vote on this proposal.
Councilman Graves commented on the concern of the Comprehensive Plan.
The Comprehensive Plan is put together to reflect the needs, desires,
and the direction the community is going to take over the next 10-20
years. This is done in a thoughtful manner and is not cast in stone,
so it can be modified as the City Council and community feels is
necessary to respond to different pressureslto address the needs of
the community. Graves felt the Comprehensive Plan should be paid
attention to, but not to use as a single point for rejection of the
proposal. Valid concerns have been brought up by the community. He
had talked to the Washington County Sheriff's office, Principal and
Vice -Principal of the School and the MPCA about these issues and none
of them expressed any negative comments relative to the development.
Sheriff Green felt they could address any potential problem that could
arise and would reject the contention that another police officer
would have to be added to the Lake Elmo area solely in response to
this development. It would be appropriate to add another patrol
officer to the community based on the increase in the population that
has occurred. The problem of drugs at the Oakland school is
diminishing, and they don't feel the truckstop would represent a
serious concern relative to the sourcing of drugs.
Graves added this is a concept plan and if accepted the Council would
be willing to have Erickson go into more detail to meet the number of
concerns. The preliminary proposal can be rejected if they do not put
the proper safeguards in that are needed. If the development
proceeds, there is a developer's agreement that would be entered into
between the developer and the community with a number of performance
criteria established. Graves stated, "The basic question that I'm
trying to resolve in my own mind is do we want development along I-94
and is this the type of development that would fit into this area?"
The considerable response that he has received has been very strongly
in support of the project. Graves would like to see the process move
along further to look at details of the plan, which the Council did
not have the opportunity to look at in this stage.
Councilman Moe referred to Page 1 of the 1979 Comprehensive Plan which
states "It is the intention of Lake Elmo that this plan be used as a
policy guide for making decisions. The plan is intended to be
flexible so that it can respond to unique situations as they arise".
Moe felt this is such a unique situation. He had talked to Sheriff
Ralph Bader regarding the Hudson Truck Stop and found out that Frank
LePlant runs a good operation and they are the one that brought the
problems up to the Sheriff's Office. Sheriff Bader informed Moe about
the new rest area that is being built and the probability of
prostitution there. Moe talked to the Asst. Principal who felt the
truckstop would not add to the truancy in the school and felt the drug
problem was not as bad as it was ten years ago. The Asst. Principal
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES MARCH 17, 1987 PAGE 10
( also stated they could use the added revenue. Moe also talked to
Sheriff Green regarding Ray's Truck Stop and found that shoplifting
was the major problem with prostitution their least concern. Green
also told Moe about increasing the police protection because of the
increase of population. The Tri-Lakes Association discussed this
situation and would like to have an added patrolman to be able to
cover their area. Moe would like to see more detail on this project
before a decision can be made.
Councilman Richard Johnson explained there were very good economic,
environmental and social reasons for concentrating the high density
development within the metropolitan urban services area. There has
been much thought that went into the 1979 comprehensive plan which he
was a part of. Johnson felt the 1979 and 1986 Comprehensive Plans are
good plans and provide for a good economic, environmental and social
future for the City. He would be opposed to going any further with
review of this project.
Mayor Arlyn Christ reviewed and researched the proposal and ha.s talked
to the same people the other Council members have talked to. The
10-page staff review that was submitted by City Administrator Overby
showed reasons why this proposal will not fit in that area of the
City. The letter written by Barbara Senness stated that the
Metropolitan Council would not approve this project even if the City
were to approve it. Christ felt the Comprehensive Plan is the City's
laws, and we don't change them for a developer to come in and tell
everybody how great it's going to be. The plan is in place and it is
his intent to abide by the city's current regulations. Christ
stressed he was steadfastly opposed to this project because it is
outside of the MUSA Line, it is where residential development belongs,
not large scale high density urban development.
M/S/P Armstrong/Johnson - to adopt Resolution 87-26 denying the
request for General Concept Plan approval of the Erickson Diversified
Interstate Freeway Service Center PUD based on the staff review of
February 2, 1987; the unanimous vote by the Planning Commission on
February 9, 1987 to recommend that the City Council deny the concept
plan as inconsistent with the 1986 Comprehensive Plan; the staff
review of March 16, 1987 Findings of Fact showing that this proposal
is inconsistent with the 1979 Comprehensive Plan; an agenda item cover
sheet which states that the concept plan would be inconsistent with
the Metro Council's 1986 Metropolitan development and Investment
Framework; and the letter written to Arlyn Christ from Barbara Senness
of the Metropolitan Council addressing that agency's concerns with the
project. (Motion carried 3-2<Graves, Moe>).
B. PUBLIC HEARING: Shoreland Permit with variances for
lot size and road frontage; Lots 292-299, Lane's
DeMontreville Country Club Addition;
James Krey and Barbara Walsh
Pursuant to published notice, Mayor Christ opened up the public hearing at
9:00 p.m. in the City Council chambers.
James Krey proposes to build a two bedroom home on Lots 2.92 thru 299
Lane's DeMontreville Country Club Addition, and adjacent vacated
rights -of -way. City Engineer Bohrer referred to his correspondence dated
March 12, 1987 in which he stated the lot size was 0.475 acres where
Shoreland Regulations require 1 1/2 acres. The average lot size in the
subdivision is 0.58 acres. Also the road frontage on Hill Trail is 60 feet
where 125 feet is required by the zoning code. All other setbacks can be
met.
A letter was received from Allen Siegel, 7951 Hill Trail and Curtis C.
Talcott, 8051 Hill Trail, stating this property was approximately the same
size as the surrounding property with a home, and they would have no
objection to his building a 1600 sq.ft. home on this site.
A letter was received from Paul E. Hanson, 8024 Hill Trail N, stating if
this lot is divided to allow another home to be built both lots will be
below the required lot size. In order to be consistent with recent
ruling, this variance should not be allowed. Bohrer responded that this is
in error.. This is a parcel of record, it is not a lot split so the
property was already divided sometime ago.
A letter dated March 13, 1987 from John Fax of the Minnesota Department of
Natural Resources stated the siting of the proposed system is critical
because it appears some of the property is sloped. If the drainpipes are
set too shallow to compensate for high water table problems, there is a
potential for waste seeping to the surface as well as pipes freezing, too.
They recommend the city carefully review this septic system design.
The City Council specifically inquired about the septic system. City
Engineer Bohrer stated that he dial find sufficient area for a drainfield
suitable for a two bedroom home and an alternate site of equal area. The
Council did express ;some concern that this two bedroom home could be
converted ino a three bedroom home by converting the den or finishing off
the bedroom in the basement. Bohrer also checked to see if a well could be
constructed on this property because the well has to be at least 50 feet
away from your own septic system or any other system. He suggested the
well go west of the driveway.
The hardship stated for the lot size variance was due to no additional
land being available for purchase and also that no other use could be
found for the land. The hardship stated for the road frontage variance is
the unusual shape of the lot.
Mayor Christ closed the public hearing at 9:12 p.m.
Councilwoman Armstrong stated it was already a substandard lot and hated
to compound problems by approving the variances. City Administrator Overby
suggested that this lot could be added to adjacent lots to make them a
( standard size lot. Councilman Graves has a concern about the potential
for compounding the problem out there, but in reality there is limited
amount of land there. The lot size is consistent with the average lot
size in the neighborhood.
M/S/P Moe/Johnson - to grant the Shoreland Permit- with variances for lot
size and road frontage contingent upon there being sufficient land
available for a septic system sized for a three bedroom home and an
alternate site of equal area. The staff can allow this permit application
to go forward provided this condition can be met. (Motion carried
4-1<Armstrong: as long as there is vacant land next to this lot, an
earnest effort should be made to buy more land>).
5. Citizen's Committee: Landfill Project Update
Dan Novak updated the City Council on the legislation that has been
introduced to the Senate and the House of Representatives. At this point
they are awaiting hearing dates from the sub -committee chairman. Their
lobbying efforts have started. Washington County has passed a resolution
stating the site of the landfill is incompatible with their parks plan and
the Metropolitan Council Parks plan; they do not want it in a park. They
call upon the State Legislature to pass the bill which prohibits landfills
being sited in a Regional Park.
Novak added, that they have recruited Sam Morgan, known as "Mr. Parks", to
testify on behalf of the legislation before the committees. They are in
the process to line up Senator Durenberger to testify for them. They are
also trying to recruit a Dr. Ginsberg from Chicago who heads up an
organization that lobbyies throughout the country trying to educate
governmental bodies on the negative ramifications of putting landfills in
regional park land. The charge for airfare, motel, transportaion will be
reported back to the Council.
This Sunday's meeting will be a training seminar for the lobbyists that
have been recruited. Also, they expect the Minnesota Geological Survey
report this week.
Todd Williams requested that the Council in the form of a letter make an
official request to the Washington County Board that they tell their paid
lobbyist to start lobbying for this bill.
Councilman Johnson complimented Dan and Todd on doing a fantastic job on
the visual aids for comparative purposes.
M/S/P Armstrong/Graves - to direct the City Administrator to write a
letter for the Mayor to sign requesting the Washington County Board asking
their paid lobbyist to start lobbying for this bill. (Motion carried
5-0).
6. CITY ENGINEER'S REPORT
A. MSA Street Project Update
On March 3, 1987 the City Council directed the City Engineer to prepare an
estimated cost if 47th Street, Kimbro Avenue, 50th Street or 43rd Street
were paved in their present condition, location and alignment and compare
that cost to constructing to MSA standards. He was also to investigate
the possible use of MSA maintenance funds for this paving.
City Engineer Bohrer referred to his correspondence dated March 12, 1987
in which he defends the adopted City Standard and their MSA Standard as
being reasonable for a safe and long lasting road design. The City Council
had previously asked for a comparative cost estimate to shape and pave the
road in its present condition and location. The correspondence gave a
comparative analysis of the estimated project cost and the potential
assessments from these various projects. Bohrer made specific
recommendations that whichever route is ultimately chosen that State Aid
standards should be followed and State -Aid funds used to construct the
road. Bohrer stated that this will result in a higher quality road, will
provide a higher level of service and require less future maintenance. It
will provide a safer road built to prevailing standards which will reduce
the City's liability and risk. Using MSA funds will also result in the
least cost to the property owner. It was further recommended that the
City not consider paving the road as it exists today. This limited
improvement will not provide any improvement in the safety concerns that
now exist along the road. This option now has the highest cost to the
property and will be more costly to mantain in the long run. This option
also exposes the City to a greater financial burden of deferred green acre
assesments.
The northern route and the southern route each contain six Green Acre lots
for which the assessments might be deferred. Under a City project this
would amount to $26,340-$38,400 in deferred assessments for the northern
route or $24,000-$32,500 in deferred assessments for the southern route.
Under an MSA project the maximum deferred assessments for either route
would be $6,000 in this example, Therefore, the City's financial exposure
for deferred assessments is much less with an MSA project.
Bohrer was asked to investigate moving the southern route curve farther to
the south to avoid the existing house. This was not recommended because
it would result in back to back reverse curves which can be confusing to
drivers and will require additional right-of-way taking.
It was confirmed with Elmer Morris, the MnDdT District State Aid Engineer,
that maintenance funds could theoretically be used to pave an MSA gravel
road. Bohrer explained that there is no definition of what constitutes
"maintenance" and what constitutes "improvements". The State Aid Rules
provide that a City may request up to 25% of its total annual allotment
for maintenance purposes. Based on the City's 1987 total allotment of
$149,305, $37,326 could be requested for maintenance. However, this
request must be made by December 15 of the previous year; therefore
maintenance funds could not be used for a project in 1987. If a 5%
increase is assumed in construction costs from 1987 to 1988 and apply the
maximum maintenance contribution, the estimated costs to pave the northern
route in 1988 is $70,250 and the southern route is $87,900.
Bohrer handed out a summary of a brief article written by a former special
assistant attorney general for the Iowa Department of Transportation which
reinforced the City Engineer's support for adopting reasonable standards
( and then consistently following those standards. The article expressed
concern about increased liability for a road agency which either does not
follow prevailing standards or chooses not to adopt standards.
A letter was received from Gilbert and Viola Sullwold, 10190 47th St. N.,
requesting that 47th Street be blacktopped to the current width and the
minimum allowable standards.
The consensus of the City Council seemed to be that they preferred
building the road to MSA standards and that they continued to prefer the
southern route. Councilman Johnson stressed that the trees should be
protected because they are an asset to the community. Sally Ziebell would
be willing to get together with the City and discuss a proposal and have a
written agreement.
M/S/P Graves/Moe - to instruct the City Engineer to apply for a variance
to State Aid standards to allow a 35 mph design speed and also to obtain a
real estate appraisal on the value of the Ray Krueger land and building if
the 40 mph design were chosen. (Motion carried 5-0).
B. Legion Pond
City Engineer Bohrer passed out copies of the Feasibility Report for
removing flood water from Legion Pond by constructing a gravity outlet
westerly to Lake Elmo.
It is proposed that an 18" gravity outlet pipe be constructed from Legion
Pond to Lake Elmo. The outlet control for Legion Pond would be a stop log
weir. This type of structure would allow the level of the pond to be
adjustable depending on downstream conditions at Lake Elmo.
Low water elevations will probably be set by the DNR because the Normal
Ordinary High Water Mark (NOHW) has not yet been established for Legion
Pond. The stop log weir may also be used to prevent flow from Elmo to
Legion Pond during periods of high water on Elmo. The VBWD has calculated
the following elevations for Lake Elmo:
Elevation
Recurrence Interval
884.5
Normal Level
889.7
10 Year
890.2
50 Year
891.1
100 Year
The pipe would be installed at about elevation 883.0. This would allow
further lowering of Legion Pond if permitted by DNR and allowed by
downstream conditions on Elmo. This would require excavation depths up to
35 feet deep and 3 to 4 feet of trench dewatering. It is anticipated that
the pipe would have to be jacked under CSAH 17 (Lake Elmo Avenue).
Only two routes appear feasible. The southern route would leave the
southwest corner of Legion Pond, run diagonally across Lot 0370 (Gordon
1 Lundholm) and then west along the north property line of Lot 0380 (Earl
Goerss).
The northern route would leave the northwest side of the pond and run
across Lot 0220 (Don Klassen); through Lot 0160 (Don Durand); to Lake Elmo
Avenue. At Lake Elmo Avenue the pipe would be routed around the south
side of Pierre's Pier and the Clyde Durand home.
The preferred route of the pipe will be determined from land and easement
acquisition costs.
City Engineer Bohrer explained that there will be times when Lake Elmo is
above its outlet. In this case, without a functioning outlet, the
critical storm would cause Legion Pond to rise about 1.5 feet. Therefore,
the flood protection dikes around the lowest home should remain in place.
The water from Legion Pond was tested for total phosphorous and clarity on
July 24, 1986 by the VBWD. The results were 67 ug/1 total phosphorous and
2.0 meters for the secchi disc. Coli£orm bacteria (an indicator for the
presence of sewage) was not tested but is anticipated to exceed the 1980
level because of the deterioration of the five lowest septic systems.
Based on a total average annual runoff volume of 42.4 acre feet to Lake
Elmo, 3.5 kg of phosphorous will be added to Lake Elmo. This amounts to
less than 2 percent of total estimated annual phosphorous load to Lake
Elmo.
Based on the information available, it does not appear that outletting
Legion Pond will have a noticeable effect on Lake Elmo water quality.
Estimated Cc
Construction $ 75,420
Contingencies (10%) 7,530
Engineering, Legal, Administrative 16,600
Permanent easements 1.3 Ac 6,500
Temporary easements 1.3 Ac 650
Total Estimated Project Cost
$106,700
It is anticipated that the entire project cost will be assessed to the
benefitting property. The majority of the benefit is to the six low homes
along the west side of Legion Avenue. There is also some benefit to the
remainder of the property around Legion Pond, but to a lesser degree.
Bohrer recommended that a preliminary real estate appraisal be done on the
Legion Pond property to determine estimated amounts.
, Permits will be required from the following agencies:
Minnesota Department of Natural Resources
Valley Branch Watershed District
Washington County Highway Department
Minnesota Department of Transportation will have approval authority on the
VBWD permit because of the use of MnDOT pipe in the downstream system.
M/S/P Graves/Armstrong - to approve the recommendations of the City
Engineer and authorize an expenditure up to $1200 to have an appraiser's
report on the increase of market value to adjacent properties around the
pond on account of this project and have a bacteria test performed on
Legion Pond so the information is available for the public hearing.
(Motion carried 5-0).
C. Cottage Grove Ravine WMO Plan
City Engineer Bohrer explained that he has reviewed the City's local plan
and the comments that he had were directed to the City and not to the WMO.
When the local plan is completed, the final copy will be sent to the
various members of the WMO.
Bohrer referred to his review letter dated February 27, 1987 in that he
made two recommendations:
a. Figure 8B - Surface Water Hydrology, should be revised
to correctly calculate the cumulative peak discharge
rates. The figure should also show the size, type and
location of the major culverts that serve as sub -
watershed outlets.
b. The Lake Elmo plan adopts the "one percent rule" so as to
avoid large expenditures for downstream improvements in
other communities. Since the one percent rule has been
successfully challenged by the City of Oakdale, Bohrer
recommended that the City Attorney review the case and
advise the City as to the correct procedure to adopt the
one percent rule. In this way the City can avoid a
possible legal challenge.
M/S/P Armstrong/Moe - to direct the City Engineer to return to the next
Council meeting with a cost estimate to perform the computer modeling of
the surface water hydrology and to instruct the City Attorney to advise
the City if the correct procedures have been carried out with the one
percent rule. (Motion carried 5-0).
7. CITY ADMINISTRATOR'S REPORT
A. Review Bids on Maintenance Dept. Pole Building
Maintenance Foreman Dan Olinger reported that there were six bids (stated
below) received on Friday, March 13, 1987 on the Maintenance Dept. Pole
Building.
Base Bid Option 1 Option 2 Option 3 Total
Lesters
$14,855
$ 1330
$ 1450 $
215
$17,850
Langers
14,500
550
1700
450
17,200
Tom DeMuth
13,762
250
750
150
14,912
Morton
15,345
694
(incl.in base*)
179
16,218
Menards
14,700
600
900
200
16,400
Holst
17,989
771
1340
194
20,294
* Maintenance Foreman, Dan Olinger stated that Morton indicated the shelf
was included in their base bid.
Olinger also stated that the bid for the door had not been clearly
specified in the bid specifications as to its location on the building and
was not bid correctly. Because the door was to go on the side of the
building, rather than an end, different material was needed. Olinger
stated ge gave each bidder the opportunity to amend their bid with this
clarification and the following are the amended bids.
Lesters $18,485
Langers 17,675
Tom DeMuth 15,737
Morton 16,487
Menards 16,875
Holst 20,769
Olinger stated that although the lowest bid received was from Tom DeMuth,
a private contractor from Paynsville, DeMuth does not have a standard
building, and provided no specs with his bid. Morton not only has a
standard building which meets or exceeds all State and County
requirements, but also has a 50 year warranty on snowload damage, a 50
year repair replacement cost to the timber columns that support the
building due to insect or decay, a 10 year warranty on their paint, due to
weathering, and a 5 year warranty due to acid rain.
For the $750 difference in the bids between DeMuth and Morton, Olinger
felt it would be in the best interest of the City to go with Morton
Builders based on the specs that were provided by Morton Builders with
their bid for this building.
Olinger further stated that the gravel base is estimated to cost $450, the
blacktop floor is estimated. to cost $2200, and the site work will be doe
by the maintenance crew. The electrical cost was stricken from the
original bids as there were no specifications provided. These bids will
be let at a later datee
M/S/P Johnson/Graves - To accept the bid of $16,487 from Morton builders
for a 42' x 75' pole building, based on the recommendation from the
Maintenance Foreman who that acceptance of this bid would be in the best
interest of the City. (Motion carried 5-0).
B. Spring Clean-up Day
Each year the City schedules a city-wide clean up day at which time
residents are encouraged to bring their trash (not garbage or tires) to
the old Lake Jane Landfill garage where dumpsters are provided to accept
material.
Maintenance Foreman Dan Olinger has scheduled the first Saturday in May
which is May 2, 1987. Olinger suggests that the City Council raise the
unit rates by $2.00 for all types except dump trucks. His rationale for
this recommendation is that the rates have been reasonable and have not
changed since 1984, whereas the cost to the City for dumpster rental has
been steadily increasing. Also, the dumpster rental rate may rise
significantly, due to the change in solid waste operations and haulers
costs as a result of the Refuse Derived Fuel Plan in Newport. The idea
behind the proposed rate increase would be to allow the City to cover its
Since we do not have time to discuss every point presented, it may seem
that decisions are preconceived. However, background information is
provided for the City Council on each agenda item in advance from City
Staff and appointed Commissions; and decisions are based on this
information and past experiences. In addition, some items may also have
been discussed at previous Council meetings. If you are aware of
information that hasn't been discussed, please fill out a "Request to
Appear Before the City Council" slip; or, if you came late, raise your
hand to be recognized. Comments that are pertinent are appreciated.
Items requiring excessive time may be continued to another meeting.
AGENDA
LAKE ELMO CITY COUNCIL
MARCH 17, 1987
7:00 p.m. MEETING CONVENES at the Lake Elmo Elementary School
11030 Stillwater Blvd.
Lake Elmo, MN
I.. Agenda
2. Minutes: February 17, 1987
3. Claims
7:05 p.m. 4. PLANNING, LAND USE AND ZONING
A. Planned Unit Development General Concept Plan:
Interstate Freeway Service Center, Co. 15 & 1-94;
Erickson Diversified Corporation
---------------------------B R E A K_------_._-_____-----___--_..
RECONVENE AT TAKE E 1110 CITY HALL AT 3800 Laverne Avenue North
8:00 P.M. B. PUBLIC HEARING: Shoreland Permit with
var ances for of size and road frontage;
Lots 292-299, Lane's DeMontreville Country
Club Addition; James ggrqand Barbara Walsh
5. Citizens Committee: Lan dfl�l Project Update
6. CITY ENGINEER'S REPORT
A. MSA Street Project Update
B. Legion Pond
C. Cottage Grove Ravine WMO Plan
7. CITY ADMINISTRATOR'S REPORT
A. Review Bids on Maintenance Dept.
Pole Building
B. Spring Clean Up -Day
C. Street Sweeping
D. Charitable Gambling Permit Guardian Angels Mens' Club
8. Adjourn