HomeMy WebLinkAbout11-23-87 PZMLAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
NOVEMBER 23, 1987
Chairman DeLapp called the Planning Commission meeting to order at
7:30 p.m. in the City Council Chambers. Present: DeLapp, Haacke,
Simpson, Hunt, Williams, Enes, Kunde, Bucheck (arrived 8:45 p.m.) and
City Administrataor Overby. Absent: Johnson, Stevens
1. Agenda
Add: 10. Planning Workshop meeting
M/S/P Williams/Hunt - to approve the November 23, 1987 Planning
Commission agenda as amended. (Motion carried 7-0).
2. Minutes: November 9, 1987
M/S/P Williams/Hunt - to approve the November 9, 1987 Planning
Commission minutes as amended. (See page 2-5. Public Hearing, page
4-7. Comprehensive Plan Amendment, page 6-B. Chapter III -Future Land
Use Section and 10. Other Business.) (Motion carried 6-0-1<Abstain:
Simpson›).
3. Upcoming Requests
December 14, 1987
Section 32-33 Discussion
Comprehensive Plan Update
December 28, 1987
This meeting was cancelled by motion at the 11-98-87 meeting. A work
committee may meet at this time if they so desire.
4. City Council Update
5. Presentation by Andy Kass, Stillwater Area Economic Development
Corporation
Andy Kass, head of the Corporation's Marketing Committee, was present
to discuss the work done to -date by SAEDC. The purpose of SAEDC is "to
encourage, promote and guide the retention, establishment, development
and expansion of business, industry and community in the Stillwater
area". To finance SAEDC and its level of need, including start-up and
operating costs, Dave Wettergren, Superintendent of District 834
Public Schools introduced a new investment opportunity ($100
certificates of investment) for the citizens of this community.
Kass discussed the merits of the Star Cities Program and how
participation in the program strengthens a community's potential for
attracting new businesses and retaining existing business as well as
its potential for selection as a business expansion site. Areas that
want more development can work with these businesses in more
development, thus directing the growth where it best fits in. Local
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES NOVEMBER 23, 1987 PAGE 2
marketing efforts, including information brochures, as well as video
and slide presentations, will provide needed information to give
developers the facts they need. Communities that have agreed to be in
the Star Cities Program are Baytown Township, Grant Township, Oak Park
Heights, Stillwater, Stillwater Township and West Lakeland Township.
Afton and Marine were not asked and the City of Lakeland turned it
down.
Kass stated that it was his understanding that Lake Elmo's City
Attorney had received a joint powers agreement to review prior to
Council action, but that there has been no response from the City to
SAEDC thus far.
Chairman DeLapp asked why was SAEDC emphasis for job creation on low
paying non -head of household positions such as light manufacturing and
retail stores. The reason was given that these jobs were most easily
attracted. If Section 32-33, which is outside the stated ISD 834
boundaries of SAEDC, DeLapp asked if it would be inside the target
area of SAEDC and Mr. Kass's answer was "yes" although there was no
explanation as to why. Rob Enes responded the reason for that was
they didn't want to break the City up.
Commissionmember Lee Hunt commented that light assembly type work is
the first to go when there are signs of a troubled economy. Hunt
would like to see how development might impact the schools with the
increase in population. The area would grow if we have industry or
not. Hunt would like to see this correlation and 1-5-10 year program
before they get his support.
6. Metro Urban Service Area (Sections 32, 33):
Study of Available Services and Financing Options from Lake Elmo
and Oakdale. Report to City Council.
At the November 17, 1987 City Council meeting the Council decided to
charge the Planning Commission with the task of studying the issue,
look at available facts, the costs and benefits, and report back with
a recommendation. The people who volunteered to serve on the economic
development committee, Section 32-33 landowners, and anyone else who
resides in Lake Elmo will be encouraged to participate in this
discussion.
City Administrator Overby explained that the City of Oakdale had
indicated that it will provide data on the costs it would charge to
Section 32-33 landowners in order to provide water service from its
existing system, and sewer service from the I-94 interceptor (assuming
that the land was annexed to Oakdale). Oakdale will include its
method of financing such services and assess the degree of risk the
City would have to encumber in order to make the land "economically
competitive". The Lake Elmo City Council expects to have a report
from the Planning Commission within 60 to 90 days from now. 1
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES NOVEMBER 23, 1987 PAGE 3
The following were present for the discussion:
David Draz, 8036 Hudson Blvd.
Mr. & Mrs. Warren Gravink, 8071 1st St. N.
Robert Henry, 8018 Hudson Blvd.
Bernard Hawkins, 8031 1st. St., N.
David Johnson, ConnCo Shoes
Bob Dreher, 7515 loth St. N (owner of 30 acres)
Mr. & Mrs. Joe Brockman
Mr. & Mrs. Harvey Brockman
Rob Enes asked, "why does your land have to be sold to a developer?
If the landowners brought the land price down low enough it would
sell." Mrs. Brockman responded that more has to be considered, roads
have to be put it, sewer and water installed and they are not a big
enough operator to do this. They donated seven acres of land to the
City of Lake Elmo in 1964/1965 for the SE ramp of the I694-10th Street
interchange with the idea of commercial coming in. Bob Dreher
explained that baceow en the City Council put in Helmo Avenue a year
before because they VIAnted to jump the gun and put in a service lane
for 694. The landowners did not ask for this but had to pay for it.
David Johnson, Connco, asked if this community was willing to do
things to allow it to become competitive or not. The property owners
have determined that there are other things that can be considered.
The land has been sitting as it is for many years with nothing
happening. The land hasn't sold because of the price (they are
willing to hang on to it because they recognize the potential), and
they have been encouraged by the City in identifying the land use plan
that this is a commercial area and no one would know this is Lake
Elmo.
Marge Williams has heard from people that are average homeowners of
Oakdale who are experiencing very high taxes and uncomfortable with
the tax increment financing. These are not the large lot owners who
have been able to go in and make some money off of the tax increment
financing. There are two sides to the coin; if you are a small
landowner your taxes are probably going to be higher than your
benefit. If you are a large landowner, your benefit would probably be
higher than your taxes.
Barb Haacke asked why does Lake Elmo want to keep Section 32 & 33 if
there was 100 percent support to have them annexed to Oakdale. Marge
Williams responded that there was not 100 percent support and there
was some interest in tradeoffs of land. Steve DeLapp felt the
question "What is the advantage to Lake Elmo in keeping Section 32 &
33?" needed to be addressed.
Lee Hunt would like to discuss the risk to both the property owners
and to the City. He suggested as a work item to try to work out a
concept based on timeline, what kind of development, if it would
require many servicds and what sewer capacity is needed.
Marge Williams felt another consideration was the effect of population
growth in Lake Elmo with the associated police, fire and other
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES NOVEMBER 23, 1987 PAGE 4
extended services which increase taxes. Also, how much is the
Planning Commission willing to amend (changing our goals and policies
in the City) the Comprehensive Plan to accommodate this type of
development and how will this affect our overall comprehensive plan.
The goals were summarized as:
1. Timelines.
2. Tax effect on overall millrate in Lake Elmo.
3. Advantage to City to keep Section 32 & 33 with appropriate
measures needed to keep it.
4. Creative alternatives to Tax Increment Financing
5. Risk to City and landowners.
- 6. How much would development be affecting our Comprehensive
Plan (population and school growths, police & fire demand).
7. Marketing Strategy.
8. How will this transition affect the small resident property owner.
A. Affect on drainfield and possible replacement
B. Would it increase the property value so that they
could sell their land for more than it is worth
keeping their house.
C. What their cost share would be for water and sewer.
After information is received from Oakdale, a schedule will be made up
and notification will be sent to the property owners.
7. Comprehensive Plan Update
A. Chapter III, Future Land Use Section
The Planning Commission was to discuss the draft of the combined City
Staff information and the Work Committee information. City
Administrator Overby included a copy of the City zoning map with the
proposed R-E future land use areas. A correction was made to the map
to include a 23 acre parcel as R-E along Highway 36. With this
correction the Planning Commission thought the R-E overlay was
reasonable as presented.
The revised draft will be submitted to the Planning Commission at the
® next meeting for them to vote on it.
B. Appendix G, Transportation Facilities --
Highway Transportation Section
The Planning Commission discussed the Traffic Assignment Zones data at
the 11-9-87 meeting. City Administrator Overby and Commission member
Marge Williams were both going to contact the Metro Council for a
definition of their employment forecasts.
City Administrator Overby had learned that the employment data
represents actual jobs that will be available within each planning
zone in the year 2000 or 2010. The employment projections were based
in part on 1980 Census data and in part on the Lake Elmo population
and housing projections. The Metro Council used the baseline data to
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES NOVEMBER 23, 1987 PAGE 5
calculate how many jobs would be needed/created in these planning
zones in Lake Elmo, according to their statistical formulas.
Obviously, the employment data are totally out of line with Lake
Elmo's planning policies and bear no relation to actual conditions in
the community.
The City Administrator had revised the narrative explaining the TAZ
table to indicate that Lake Elmo does not agree with or support the
employment forecasts and will not honor such data in making local
decisions about local road needs. A copy of the revised text was
submitted to the PZC for consideration.
Marge Williams had talked to Robert Paddock from the Transportation
Section of the Metro Council who told her that the Traffic Assignment
zones are totally incorrect. The projected figures in the column
"Year 2000" were generated from a data base that goes back to the 1970
census and Metropolitan Plans at that time. The column headed 2010
were generated from data off the 1980 census and even those are
perceived to be incorrect since the growth throughout the Metro area
is seen as being lowered in 1987 as was projected in 1980.
Marge felt the most interesting part of the information is that it is
not even done with consideration of the Comprehensive Plan of Lake
Elmo.
The Commission felt it was not necessary to do anything with these
figures. Therefore, the following motion was made.
M/S/P Hunt/Bucheck - to recommend that the City Council approve the
Highway Transportation Section of Appendix G, as amended 11-20-87
(with the elimination of the last two pages) for submittal to the
Metro Council as a Comprehensive Plan Amendment. (Motion carried
8-0).
8. Metro Council "Metropolitan Significance" Rule Changes
The Metro Council is looking for input on the proposed rule changes.
The rules are part of a process that allows Lake Elmo to comment on
projects in adjacent cities that would be studied and reviewed by the
Metro Council.
A comment was made that the economic issues the Council were concerned
about are not valid to Lake Elmo. Environmental issues, the quality
of life, the impact of low income housing and school district growth
in our community were comments from the Planning Commission, but were
not unanimous.
9. Purchase of Planning Books
Four Planning Commission members and the City Administrator attended
the zoning workshop held on November 14th. Several good
planning -zoning reference books were made available for viewing. The
Commission is requesting purchase of one of each book available at the
workshop.
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES NOVEMBER 23, 1987 PAGE 6
M/S/P Simpson/Hunt - to adjourn the Planning Commission meeting at
11:15 p.m. (Motion carried 8-0).
l
The Planning Commission is an advisory body to the City Council.
One of the Commission's functions is to hold public hearings and make
recommendations to the City Council. The City Council makes all final
decisions on these matters.
Lake Elmo Ordinances require that certain documents and
information be included in applications. The Planning Commission may
postpone consideration of an application that is incomplete and may for
other reasons postpone final action on an application.
For each item, the Commission will receive reports prepared by
the City Staff, open the hearing to the public, and discuss and act on the
application. If you are aware of information that hasn't been discussed,
please fill out a "Request to Appear Before the Planning Commission" slip;
or, if you came late, raise your hand to be recognized. Comments that are
pertinent are appreciated.
7:30 p.m.
AGENDA
LAKE ELMO PLANNING COMMISSION
NOVEMBER 23, 1987
MEETING CONVENES
1. Agenda
2. Minutes: November 9, 1987
3. Upcoming Requests
4. City Council Update
7:45 p.m. 5. Presentation by Andy Koss, Stillwater Area
Economic Development Corporation
8:15 p.m.
6. Metro Urban Service Area (Sections 32,33):
Study of Available Services and Financing Options
from Lake Elmo and Oakdale. Report to City Council.
8:45 p.m. 7. Comprehensive Plan Update
A. Chapter III, Future Land Use Section
(Bring your complete draft)
B. Appendix G, Transportation Facilities --
Highway Transportation Section
9:45 p.m. 8. Metro Council "Metropolitan Significance"
Rule Changes
9. Purchase of Planning Books
10. Other Business
11. Adjourn