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HomeMy WebLinkAbout07-28-03 PZMMEETING NOTICE A Regular Meeting of the Lake Elmo Planning Commission and the Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Will be held on Monday, July 28, 2003 at 7:00 p.m. In Council Chambers, Lake Elmo City Hall 3800 Laverne Ave. N. Lake Elmo, MN 55042 AGENDA 1) Pledge of Allegiance 2) Agenda 3) After the Fact Approval to Move a Building Into City 4) Proposal for Regulation of Motorized Recreational Vehicles Convene: Old Village Special Proiects Planning Commission 5) Minutes of July 14, 2003 6) Old Village Neighborhood Design Study 7) Adjourn The public is invited to attend. AFFID1-VIT OF PUBLICATION tiErtuater a3ette 1931 Curve Crest Blvd. Stillwater, MN 55082 (651) 439-3 1 30 Fax: (651) 439-4713 7/18/03 State of Minnesota} ss. County of Washington} l'he undersigned, being duly sworn, on oath, says that s/he is the Publisher or authorized agent and employee of the Publisher known as the Stillwater Evening Gazette, and has full knowledge of the facts which are stated. (A) The newspaper has complied with all of the requirements constituting qualification as a qualified newspaper, as provided by Minnesota State Statute 33 I A.02, 33 l A.07 and other applicable laws as amended. Printed below is a copy of the lowercase Alphabet, from A to Z, both inclusive. which is hereby acknowledged as being the size and kind type used in composition and publicatio [, f theol notice. abcdc iijldmnopyrstuv xyz Pu is er/Authorized Agent Subscribed and sworn to or affirmed to me on this / D day of 3 LA Notary ltiblic City of Lake Elmo 3800 Laverne Ave. N. Lake Elmo, MN 55042 Inches 4 Lake Elmo Description City of Lake Elmo Notice of Public Hearing for Jerome and Tracy Pierre, Published 7/18 Maximum rate per column inch under Minnesota Law: $16.90 per 12-pica column NOTARY Pti8LiC - M;NNES0 T t, Expir,s , 2003.. ' Invoice #: 00002488 Terms: Net 30 Price Total $4.20 $16.80 $16.80 Sub Total $16.80 Payment $0.00 Balance Due $16.80 CITY OF Lake Elmo STILLWATER GAZETTE, JULY 18, 2003 CITY OF LAKE ELMO WASHINGTON COUNTY, MINNESOTA NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING The Lake Elmo Planning Commission Will hold a meeting on o da ul 2� 8 2003 7 00 o m at Lake Elmo City Hall 3800 Laverne Avenue North Lake Elmo, MN 55042 Pursuant to Chapter 5, Section 505.05 of the Lake Elmo Municipal Code, the Planning Commission is calling a Public Hearing to consider the application of Jerome and Tracy Pierre to move a garage onto their property in the City of Lake Elmo. The property is legally described as Lot 2, Block 2, DEMONTRE- VILLE HIGHLANDS 3rd ADDITION, and Property I.D. No. 05.029.21.14.0008. The public is invited to attend. /s/Charles E. Dfllerud Charles E. Dillerud Acting City Administrator & City Planner 7/18 DRAFT City of Lake Elmo PLANNING 01 OLD VILLAGE SPECIAL PROJECTS COMMISSION Meeting Minutes of July 28, 2003 Vice Chairman Berg called to order the meeting of the Lake Elmo Planning Commission at 7:00 p.m. COMMISSIONERS PRESENT: Ptacek, Van Pelt, Sedro, Meldahl, Pelletier, Deziel (7:08), Bunn (7:12). STAFF PRESENT: City Planner Chuck Dillerud and Recording Secretary Kimberly Schaffel. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE AGENDA M/S/P, Ptacek/Sedro, To amend agenda by adding Council Update. VOTE: 6:0. AFTER THE FACT APPLICATION TO MOVE A BUILDING INTO THE CITY City Planner The Code provides for moving a structure from outside the community. Such an application must be reviewed by the City prior to moving the structure. The Building Official looks at it for two factors, structural and architectural. We then notify property owners within 350 feet of the parcel where the structure will be placed, a hearing is called at the Planning Commission, then it moves on to the City Council. The City was notified that the building arrived in the early morning on a weekend, staff checked and there was no application. The owners filed an after -the -fact permit application. The Planner went to the site, and viewed the structure and its proposed placement. Except for one area, it meets the setbacks. The Building Official says it is in good shape. The Code says no accessory structure may be closer to the front property line than the principal structure. This is a corner lot. The definition of front property line on a corner lot is the side with the smallest street frontage. Because the house is situated facing the longer street frontage, it appears that this accessory structure would be closer to the front property line than the house. However, that issue will be handled exclusively by the City Council. Findings 1. That the garage structure is structurally sound, as certified by the Building Official. 2. That Section 300.13 Subd 3A2 provides that any detached residential structure be of, "...color, design and materials...similar to the principal structure." In this case the design is similar, and the applicants can modify the color and/or materials for compliance. 3. The proposed structure and location on the lot complies with all City Code standards except Section 300.13 Subd.A5I. 4. Relief from the terms of Section 300.13A5I is a City Council determination, with no Planning Commission recommendation specified by the City Code. Conditions Staff recommends approval subject to City Council front lot line determination, and subject to the following conditions: 1. Residing of the garage by the applicants within 90 days to match the principal structure. 2 Provision_to_the_City_ofiinanciaLsecurity,_in_an_amount-specified_b-y-the Building-Official,—tc insure completion of the siding project within the specified time frame. Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 DRAFT 3. Payment by the app( nt of an application fee in an amount doy that required by the City Fee Schedule for moving an accessory structure in to the City as penalty for proceeding without the permit. Graphics are provided and Code copies. The applicant provided background materials. Vice Chairman Berg Procedurally, do we potentially put the cart before the horse? City Planner No, you can approve the move and the City Council could reject the lot line issue. Tracy Pierre, Applicant They had no intention to make changes to the structure without a permit. Gene Warner, 5640 Hvtrail Avenue He lives directly across the street from the applicants. He read a letter aloud which is attached for the record. He is in favor of the structure being allowed to remain. Dave Nielsen 5680 Highlands Trail He met with Jerry about his intentions. He is closest to the structure. He is in favor of its proposed location. Dave Austad, 5701 Hvtrail Avenue He has no objections. Once it is resided, it will fit perfectly. The applicant has done much landscaping, like all the neighbors, because of significant water problems. A letter in the packet came from another neighbor that objects to the application. Jerry Pierre, Applicant The construction material stored next to the garage is for the garage residing. Commissioner Ptacek The neighbor's letter refers to a second driveway, with egress off Highlands Trail. City Planner That is allowed. M/S/P, Ptacek/Van Pelt, To recommend approval by the City Council of the application after the fact to move a structure into the city, with recommendations, findings, and conditions from the Planner's Staff Report dated July 23. Commissioner Bunn The neighbor talks about a business use. City Planner Everything he saw was related to the garage. That is a separate issue and does not bear on this hearing. VOTE: 8:0. PROPOSAL FOR REGULATION OF MOTORIZED RECREATIONAL VEHICLES City Planner One month ago, a resident approached the City Council asking that Section 11 of the Code be modified for motorized recreational vehicles. All the City Council did was to refer it to the Planning Commission Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 2 DRAFT for review of that citizen's r( nmendations. The Planning Commissioi( Ly direct the Planner to draft Code language or advise the city Council that the Code is fine the way it is. The City Council modified the language not long ago to comply with changes in state language. Recommendations made by the citizen are: • Recreational ATV's may only be operated on lots of 5 acres or more. Now they are permitted on any size lot. • No ATV riding may take place within 150 feet of a property line. That would also eliminate all ditch riding. • Hours of operation should be from 10 am to 5 pm every day of the week. Now it is prohibited between 11 pm and 7 am. Each of these changes is very significant. His initial response was that we have enough changes already, but he understands the problem here. These changes would go more toward small lots with houses very close together. The Commission might wish to address regulations on a geographic basis like in more urbanized neighborhoods. Many of our neighboring cities do that. We are a middle -ground community with some neighborhoods partially urbanized like in the Old Village and Tri-Lakes areas. Commissioner Deziel Part of the nuisance is a noise nuisance. Do we have a noise ordinance? City Planner Yes, but we don't have a decibel meter to measure the noise. Commissioner Bunn For the purpose of yard chores, it seemed inappropriate to ban chore use for an ATV. Recreational use seems inappropriate for small dense lots. There might be an enforcement issue. Commissioner Meldahl He hears a lot of things operating in his neighborhood. His neighbors got together and had a talk. We don't need to create more Code, when we can't enforce the ones we have now. This sounds like a neighborhood problem that should be solved in the neighborhood. M/S/P, Ptacek/Meldahl, The Planning Commission should not waste time on this neighborhood nuisance issue. Send it back to the City Council without recommendation. Commissioner Sedro We put a lot of work into staying rural. We need to find a way to keep larger lots. Commissioner Deziel This proposed ordinance change is discriminatory for people with smaller lots. Commissioner Pelletier This is a neighborhood issue. Commissioner VanPelt He would be in favor of the motion but offered a friendly amendment: To recommend to the City Council to take no further action. Don't do anything further with it. Leave it alone. The Mover and Seconder accepted the amendment. Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 3 DRAFT Commissioner Bunn She opposes the motion because she would not want it in her neighborhood. She would be more in favor of a recommendation to staff for geographical zoning. Commissioner Bere He would oppose the motion because he preferred the research was done first. VOTE: 5:3 (Bunn/Pelletier/Berg). Audience members wished to speak in favor of not changing the law. The Planner explained that it was no longer an issue before the Planning Commission. COUNCIL UPDATE City Planner The Workshop last week for the Neighborhood Design Study went very well. The Community Facilities Committee listened to a financial advisor for bonding options for new public buildings that may be on the horizon. They requested a series of sites within the next two weeks where combined public facilities could dwell. Today he reviewed the 1995-96 Public Works site. Commissioner Williams What about Old Village Sidewalks? City Planner He was waiting to see where the money could come from. The legislature bailed out communities who forgot to levy by saying they could add forgotten levy on to the 2004 levy. It might be 9 months before we get a decision from the Metropolitan Council. ADJOURN FIVE MINUTES RECONVENE AS OLD VILLAGE SPECIAL PROJECTS 7:55 PM MINUTES OF JULY 14, 2003 Commissioners Williams and Bunn said we should remove June 11 from the minutes, they were not approved without amendments; there were amendments. Commissioners Bunn, Williams, Bucheck, and Ptacek made changes to the minutes. M/S/P, Williams/Van Pelt, To approve the Minutes of July 14, 2003 as amended. VOTE: 8:0. City Planner Councilmember DeLapp, by way of explanation, created two more colored maps explaining another option for the Old Village Neighborhoods. He will explain them. Dewey Thorbeck sent a cover e-mail and some graphics with more detail of public areas for the Schiltgen farm south of 5. Because they just arrived, we will review them at the next meeting. What does the Commission want Dewey to do further? Are we going to hold a Public Hearing, and if so, what should we do in it? He reminded the commissioners that the moratorium extends until October 24. We should keep moving forward. We don't want to lose our momentum. Vice -Chairman -Berg - He suggested the Commission review items one through five on the Planner's Staff Report. Commissioner John Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 4 DRAFT It is a fair reflection of what( heard at the meeting. Commissioner Bunn Item 1 is a concern because one councihnember did not want the senior housing next door to his home, and the neighbors he spoke with were against it because it would bring development next door to them. Maybe senior housing could be moved to the city center; move it out of the mainstream. Main Street loses its focal point and appears to be demoted when buffers are added between old and new residences. She worries about walkability and supporting downtown businesses. Commissioner Deziel The buffering puzzled him because there weren't very many places where old met new. There are only a couple of areas where that happens. Although a buffer could be put in pretty easily. City Planner Maybe the issue wasn't always the new housing but the public facilities and the senior housing. It could easily be designed differently. Vice Chairman Berg A potential buffer is demonstrated by the graphics. Commissioner Bunn Moving toward the Public Hearing for a Comprehensive Plan Amendment, does that dovetail with finding the sites for this combined public area? It seems that would take much longer than our timeframe would allow. Would we want to include that on our map? City Planner It does sort of dovetail. It could be the ball fields or west of Gorman's. Another area under consideration in 1995 was 39th Street. It could make a big difference. Commissioner Bunn There are a lot of issues involved that won't get resolved in the next month or two. City Planner We could show public facilities in both areas and one of the areas could end up being ball fields. Commissioner Bunn Prior to rebuilding Lake Elmo Motors, there was talk about Lake Elmo Avenue going straight north. Is that completely dead? City Planner For our purposes, we must remember that those are private property owners and they are not vacant properties. Commissioner Van Pelt How much detail will we need and when? City Planner Generally a Land Use Plan involves blobs of specific zones. You generalize and maybe show the basic street system. The problem is that once we adopt a Comprehensive Plan Amendment, we have nine months to change the zoning. It was never an issue in the past but it will be in this case. ro mmissioner_V_anP_elt We have two months for the amendment plus nine months to enforce it. Are we doing first things first? Maybe we shouldn't be doing detailed planning right now. Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 5 DRAFT City Planner i ! The implementation is the abinty to assemble the land itself. In design competition, we have to use more conventional tools like zoning. We don't have mechanics in place for traditional TDR here. Commissioner Van Pelt Maybe the higher order issues have to be dealt with first. City Planner We should have all our ducks in a row with the how before we can get farther with the design detail. Commissioner Ptacek We are very fortunate that Lane Kendig was there with Dewey Thorbeck. He felt comfortable with Mr. Kendig's experience. He will come up with zoning right away. We should define some of Option 4 without getting into the detail. He is glad to be talking about facilities again. Commissioner John When discussing public facilities, it was never his impression that Public Works became part of City Hall itself. If City Hall is sited, it may not also be the best site for a maintenance facility. Commissioner Williams Did the Chisago TDR Ordinance copy arrive? City Planner Chisago never used it. There wasn't much there. He dumped it. Commissioner Williams Because it is an unknown, we owe it to ourselves to educate ourselves. We should see it. In this kind of community, broad borders house a broad zoning category. An existing category is what is currently allowed. Now we will be dealing with potentially new categories that we do not have experience with. Unless we are very detailed, it is a real black bag. We don't have an ordinance for it yet. He thinks we should not go to a Public Hearing with it. Commissioner Meldahl The right steps might include the shifting of public buildings; moving the City into the elementary school. Get a new school on 39"' street. Senior housing could be placed on Schiltgen and it would be closer to fire and police for emergencies. Roads are too small for senior housing where it was originally indicated in Option 4. Commissioner Van Pelt He would not want to see the Planning Commission come out with a plan that is a black box. If we get very detailed without answering fundamental questions first it will fall apart. He does not know how to close up the box but there are major issues like: will TDR work? what are the alternatives? We will not have the opportunity to implement any of this without answers to those questions. Commissioner Bucheck Is the unit count 366 plus commercial? City Planner Commercial is not zoned residential. How do we convert it to residential density? We can take relative wastewater generation as a limiting factor. How much does commercial wastewater relate to in residential units. That is how we made the calculation. It is seventy -something. That did use the entire 24acres._Some_remained_in_the_Comprehensi-ve-Plan. We_would -have -to-decide_ Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 6 DRAFT Councilmember DeLann He suggested more details. W e have to have more detail going into a Comprehensive Plan. He broke it down by low urban density residential and medium urban density residential, and converting high use further up north. No good to have high density townhouses on 39°i. You don't just get rid of Lions Park which has been the city center for forty years. Adjacent to the park should be a concentrated commercial district. Parking should be downtown too. Commissioner John If we adopt this global zoning, underneath it we have seen the presentations and everyone might be "ghost platting" those areas. Is there an advantage to having one zone as commercial? City Planner He does not see it as a Comprehensive Plan Amendment with cookie cutter zones. He sees it as with or without transfer of density rights. But we don't have that wording yet. He agrees it becomes kind of a ghost plat. Commissioner Bucheck Years ago there were meetings at the school. At that time they said no big boxes, slow traffic, and bring in some senior housing located where people can walk to something. Those are still the things that are important. Councilmember DeLapp's plan is for businesses in town. Councilmember DeLann Residents and seniors aren't going to shop at an auto dealer and upholstery shop. City Planner Aren't we thinning those opportunities from ever developing there? Councilmember Bucheck The barber shop and beauty salon can get used. City Planner The analogy is that a town's end shopping center destroys a downtown. He is not too concerned with disturbing the residents. Somebody will be disturbed no matter what. What about locating more commercial from the Post office to the fire hall and Lions Park, and make a courtyard there right next to what is downtown now? Vice Chairman Bere We had the map from the last meeting that was generalized. We can add verbiage to say things like, Senior Housing should be walkable. We are getting too hung up on details. Commissioner Bunn Don't we have to designate which areas have to be public? City Planner Maybe we should have the bullets before we have the gun. Commissioner Bunn Without the Comprehensive Plan Amendment, we will get Option 1. Land deals are ready to go. The moratorium is about to expire in October. We are under -planned for what we are trying to do. We don't have an answer to whether or how TDR will work. Lane Kendig gave no examples or wording, no specifics, just an off -hand comment. Maybe we need hired planners to give us the information in detail. The_economic_study presented was_unclear_and_not-well=founded and -was -unconvincing Thorbeck'r Options 4 and 4 Revised are great plans, great ideas. With nothing decided, it will take a great deal of planning leadership to get us there. Facilities locations are technical issues and practical issues. We have the dilemma of the deadline on one hand and on the other hand whether to spend a significant amount of Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 7 DRAFT money to get a contract plan on board to get us where we want to go. ; said it was no reflection on our City Planner; he has been excellent and has been doing two jobs. We need serious answers to complex issues. She would recommend to the City Council to analyze planning needs over the next three weeks to come up with more planning support. Commissioner Deziel Details are going to help us as a valuable tool. We can't get into that level of detail right now, and maybe a subcommittee can get into those locations. We need to be able to go through it several times to get to where we are going. Even if we don't need it now, we will need something in a year from now. Arranging where things are going to be located, allows us to go forward with overall concept. Commissioner John TDR has not been sufficiently explored by our consultants. Chisago developed TDR and is not using it. It is skeletal and without substance. There must be somewhere else in the U.S. who is doing TDR, so we can consider its application to our city. Commissioner Pelletier We are getting too detailed. Councilmember Siedow said he would not vote for anything unless he knew what exactly would be placed next door to his home. Commissioner Van Pelt was absolutely right, we need to get direction to move forward. We need to find out about TDR from the Planner. Commissioner Bucheck Make a list, first, is TDR going to work? If not, this plan won't work. Councilmember DeLann Fields II agreed with three owners and they cooperated for development. City Planner It is happening on the east coast and he is happy to do it. Lane Kendig was not hired for TDR or the Old Village. The City Planner is becoming frustrated with the lack of momentum here. Commissioner Van Pelt It doesn't diminish the work already done. Create a work plan to execute in the next few months. What do we need to do to get done, to get to our objectives? The issues are TDR, some amount of detail, and Siedow's house. We are struggling. We have great ideas but will they take us where we want to be? Commissioner Williams Ask for Public Hearing on a Comprehensive Plan Amendment on August 25. We passed a motion to do that. M/S/P, Williams/Bucheck, Postpone the Public 1-fearing for a Comprehensive Plan Amendment until the second meeting in September. Vice Chairman Berg He read the motion from the last meeting. Commissioner Williams It is too much and too big to get done in one month. City Planner It won't get done without an extension. We may run past the moratorium date. That time period is the minimtun_we_need_to_get_dorie Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 8 DRAFT Commissioner Bunn We need a work list. What would be the location of public facilities? Is TDR possible? How will it work in this city? What would be our substitute mechanism if TDR would not work? We need to know sufficient detail on the border and siedow area. Councilmember DeLann DeLapp wants the motion to pass because the problems won't be gone through by August 25. He would rather they all participate in it. It is too big an issue not to understand the reality. There will be things locked in for that untimely deadline. If there is a recommendation with a formal process for August 25, we would have to clarify and undo some of what the Planning Commission has done. The City Council can set a moratorium extension, and they would probably postpone it. Owners have a right to be treated fairly. If owners want to cooperate and help us out with background resolutions, it would speed things up a lot. Commissioner John The problem he has is SFR. These are receiving areas for TDR. OP areas could be sending areas. Commissioner Pelletier Would Todd's time frame be sufficient? City Planner He does not know, but it gives us a target. He can't tell if that is enough time but it will take at least that long. THE SECRETARY READ THE MOTION. VOTE: 5:1:2 (Ptacek opposed; Bunn/Deziel abstained.). Commissioner Ptacek exited the meeting at 9:20 p.m. Commissioner Williams This body is reluctant to make amendments to motions. Another date could have been suggested. He presented a motion to get things opened up. Commissioner Deziel He challenged commissioners to recognize the Chair and said some commissioners speak out of order. Vice Chairman Berg He agreed there has to be procedure. A motion can also be withdrawn. Commissioner Williams With the Planner's work load, is there any leg work they could do to help? Should they meet weekly? Mapping some of the facilities could be done by commissioners. Citv Planner He sees no value in meeting weekly. He does not want commissioners making outside contacts while others are looking to him for answers. He does not want another committee for him to attend. Commissioner Deziel We needed to have TDR to do anything in this plan. It shouldn't only be on TDR. Let's not limit ourselves unnecessarily. Councilmember Bucheck What is Dewey Thorbeck doing? Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 9 DRAFT City Planner el Q He is just waiting to hear what we are going to do. We have overspent the contract by going around and round. He told him not to take the plan and put it into Comp Plan form. If you read what he sent along, he is getting good vibes on a master developer. We talked about inter - property owner transfer. He is afraid a master developer will carry so much clout that person will feel he does not want to listen to the Planning Commission. A PUD would work with one master developer, but not with five properties. Commissioner Bunn We need the expertise, effectiveness, and timeliness. She is confused that the Planner does not want the commissioners to help further, but we are out of money. How will he come to them with facilities? City Planner The Facilities Commission is looking at that exclusively. How does it work with TDR? He will get on the phone and get it himself. Dewey Thorbeck will be helpful. Commissioner Bunn We hired an expert for zoning. Why couldn't he be hired for TDR too? He is also talking master developer. There is the issue of a senior housing location. There will be education issues for the Old Village residents. That would also take a great deal of time. City Planner He does not know how it will work. He will make some progress on TDR and work with the Facilities Committee for the public facilities sites. Commissioner Van Pelt He supported the extension because there is a great deal of work to do. He would like the group to address how we measure our progress, with a work plan or list. We want a viable, executable plan that is also executable politically. There is work to be done on those two fronts. We should resolve that tonight not just add a month. We need to understand those show -stopping issues and spend the next few months just dealing with them. Commissioner Sedro We hired an expert in TDR and performance zoning. He suggested a list of incentives and disincentives for performance by landowners. We should consider the expert's recommendation and follow it. Commissioner Deziel It will work itself out and will let itself show which direction it we have to determine. 11 go. The mechanism we use is what City Planner One measure is that we have August 11 for our first goal for how is TDR is working/operating now. We can talk about its mechanics. We can then decide if it will work. Commissioner Bunn What other alternatives are there? Can we find out from Lane Kendig or others? City Planner It is EDA where the land is controlled Commissioner—V-anP-elt August 11 we should also talk about a list of "show -stoppers with this level of design." That is what we will talk about for the following month. He would like it on that Agenda. We need to understand it in Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 10 DRAFT totality. A show stopper pre `s us from getting to where we want to be acilities Committee suggests Public Works and City Hall in the same building. Commissioner Williams Should we meet with that commission? City Planner Not yet. He wants them to look at siting issues from the old objective point of view. Then we can get the two commissions together. Commissioner Williams They can inform us of technical issues and we can inform them of our issues. Commissioner Deziel We might be willing to move some of those details forward. He would be willing to help Councilmember DeLapp. Councilmember Bucheck What about Councilmember Siedow? Councilmember DeLann A Comprehensive Plan Amendment requires four votes. Neither Siedow nor I will vote for it. We need more, not less ball fields. We might as well draw a boundary with the 100 property owners in the Old Village because we will never get them to agree with it. Commissioner Williams He has been involved with committees and commissions, he understands that subcommittees might go in the wrong direction. If there is communication with this body, then their going off is held in check. That is why he suggested meeting more frequently. We have people and resources that could be used to greater benefit. Commissioner VanPelt That could be another topic for next week. Some might flow out as logical tasks that we can work on. Vice Chairman Berg Anyone wishing to do that has to answer to the bigger body. Adjourned 9:55 p.m. Respectfully submitted, Kimberly Schaffel Recording Secretary Planning & Old Village Special Projects Planning Commission Meeting of July 28, 2003 11