HomeMy WebLinkAboutTimeSavers-.05-21-2019 Draft-Charter-MinutesMounds View Charter Commission Minutes
Tuesday, May 21, 2019
1.Call to Order – The meeting came to order at 7:02 p.m.
2.Roll Call – Present: B. Amundsen, B. Clawson, D. Erickson, J. Klander, J. Peterson,
M. Reyes-Johnson, B. Staples, J. Thomas, R Warren
Excused: None
Absent: None
NOT PRESENT: None.
3.Approval of Agenda
Amundson requested an amendment to the agenda separating Commission Business into
Unfinished and New Business – Old Business should be Review of TimeSaver Trial, then
Items B, C and D. New Business should be Review Secretaries Duties then Items E and
A, followed by an item that would Set Next Agenda Items.
Klander stated he did not see a reason to separate New Business from Old Business.
Further discussion ensued regarding the format of the Charter Commission agenda. The
Commission supported separating Unfinished Business and New Business under
Commission Business per the Charter Commission Bylaws.
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by R. Warren, to amend the agenda.
Amundsen stated he made the motion because he believed it would be quicker to
amend the agenda then to add the items later in the meeting.
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by B. Clawson, to approve dividing the
question.
Thomas indicated he would not be supporting the motion to divide the question.
Motion Failed 2-7 (Chair Reyes-Johnson and Klander supported).
The Chair called the question on the motion on the floor.
Motion Approved 7-2 (Chair Reyes-Johnson and Klander opposed).
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by J. Thomas, to approve agenda as amended.
Motion Approved
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
Regular Meeting Page 2
Approval of Minutes
Thomas stated he would not approve the minutes from TimeSaver noting Commission
minutes were to state only what action was taken. He explained the minutes from
TimeSaver were completed on a trial basis for review purpose.
Reyes-Johnson reported on Page 2 of the minutes, Lines 14 and 15 the Charter
Commission approved a motion to direct staff to hire TimeSaver on a trial basis to assist
with Charter Commission minutes. She asked if a Charter parliamentarian could direct her
on how to proceed.
Amundsen reported the Charter Commission does not have a parliamentarian.
City Attorney Riggs advised the Chair had the right to ask questions and noted the Charter
Commission could adopt either set of minutes. He reported there was no set procedure
within the bylaws regarding meeting minutes. He explained the Charter Commission
approved a trial run for minutes with TimeSaver. He indicated the bylaws had no set
format for the minutes but rather were to be approved by the nine members of the group.
He reported the group could deviate on the minutes while still recording votes. He stated
he did not understand why the group had competing minutes when there didn’t need to be.
He commented the only thing the secretary does within the Charter Commission was to
present the minutes back to the Chair so the entire Commission can review and approve
the minutes, which was no different than the EDA or City Council. He indicated he
understood past practices, but reminded the group of the action that was taken at the
March 21st meeting to hire TimeSaver on a trial basis.
Peterson reported at the last meeting the work being done by TimeSaver was on a trial
basis and the current process was not being replaced. City Attorney Riggs reported this
would be determined by the Charter. He commented he did not see much difference
between the two sets of minutes.
Clawson indicated he was not in attendance at the last meeting. He requested further
information on what was going on and suggested each member take a step back to
evaluate the situation. He reported he reviewed both sets of minutes and did not see any
substantial differences. He explained he could support either set of minutes. He
encouraged the Commission to move forward with approving a set of minutes and to get
on with the agenda. He stated it was the prerogative of the Chair to run the meeting how
she sees fit.
Motion by J. Thomas, seconded by J. Peterson, to recommend the Charter
Commission consider approval of the minutes submitted by the secretary.
Peterson stated he would support approving the minutes from the secretary versus
TimeSaver given the fact the TimeSaver minutes were incomplete.
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Regular Meeting Page 3
Klander explained the Planning Commission has never had an issue with their
TimeSaver minutes and noted the missing information from the Charter minutes
was due to a tape issue.
Reyes-Johnson reported she did not receive minutes from the secretary until last
Thursday. She indicated she requested the missing information from the secretary
in order to fill in the TimeSaver minutes and this information was refused.
Amundsen stated he took exception to this comment and believed it was
inappropriate.
Motion 8-1 (Chair Reyes-Johnson opposed)
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by J. Peterson, to approve the minutes of
March 19, 2019 as submitted by the secretary.
Motion Approved
4.Citizens Comments from the Floor
None.
5.Reports of Chair
Reyes-Johnson provided the Commission with an update from the City Council noting the
Council was in favor of an 18-month clause. She reported Chapter 4 would be updated to
reflect this information. She requested comment from the City Attorney regarding officer
duties.
City Attorney Riggs reported there were some issues on how the group was moving
forward. He explained he reviewed the bylaws with respect to the secretary’s duties
relative to the chair’s duties. He advised per the bylaws the meeting is to be run by the
chair, the agenda is drafted by the chair and items are to be brought to the chair. He
indicated the secretary was to prepare the records, record the minutes and votes at each
meeting stating what was done and submit them to the chair prior to the next meeting. He
stated City staff was able to act as the conduit to make copies and forward items to the
Charter Commission members. He indicated the roles of the chair and secretary were very
clear in the bylaws and stated he could take questions from the group in order to address
the present conflict.
Amundsen explained he asked for an item to be placed on the agenda and reported he had
additional documentation to handout at that time.
Warren asked if the City Council direction would be coming through a resolution or
recommendation. City Attorney Riggs commented the idea would be for the City Council
to reach a unanimous vote. City Administrator Zikmund explained this item would be
further addressed under New Business – Process for Chapter 4.
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Regular Meeting Page 4
Clawson questioned why the Council had settled on 18 months.
Reyes-Johnson stated the Council had initially wanted to follow State Statute which was
24 months. However, given the fact the Mayor’s term was only for 2 years the Council
recommended the 18-month window be pursued for a special election for the Mayor,
should the position become vacant.
Reports of Members
Amundsen reported he attended the recent Council worksession meeting and explained
Councilmember Meehlhause wanted to see action on the Chapter 4 issue. He stated he
was happy to see an adjustment would be made. He commented further on the budget
discussion that was held by the Council at the worksession meeting.
Thomas indicated he was a bit over zealous about abiding to the bylaws. He stated he
believed it would be beneficial for the group to follow the bylaws in place but noted he
could support an amendment.
6.Commission Business
Unfinished Business
Review TimeSaver Trial.
City Administrator Zikmund reported complete minutes were not submitted because there
was a tape issue with the brand new equipment. He stated the City had not had a similar
event in the past. He explained the Charter Commission offered unanimous support to
direct staff to have TimeSaver complete minutes. He indicated the thought was that this
would free up all members to engage in discussion. He commented the City had put funds
aside in the 2020 budget for completion of the meeting minutes by TimeSaver.
Peterson stated the Commission had approved supporting a trial for TimeSaver. City
Administrator Zikmund reiterated that the Commission offered unanimous support
directing staff to work with TimeSaver to have the minutes completed.
Warren questioned if TimeSaver was taking minutes for this meeting.
Reyes-Johnson reported the video for this meeting could be sent to TimeSaver for
transcription.
Warren stated based on the first set it was not so good, because the equipment did not
work. City Administrator Zikmund reported TimeSaver successfully completes minutes
for the City Council and Planning Commission.
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
Regular Meeting Page 5
Warren inquired if the Commission had to take action in order to have TimeSaver
complete minutes for this meeting. City Administrator Zikmund stated the tape and
meeting packet could be sent to TimeSaver for transcription.
Reyes-Johnson explained her thought would have been to have TimeSaver complete one
more set of minutes, given the fact there were technology problems at the March meeting.
She stated the group could then hold a discussion at its next meeting to reassess the
situation.
Warren asked if Amundsen was comfortable taking minutes for the Charter Commission
going forward.
Motion by R. Warren, seconded by J. Klander, to direct staff to have TimeSaver
complete minutes for the next three Charter Commission meetings and that
Amundsen’s meeting minutes be accepted as the official document of record.
Amundsen questioned what the process would be in reviewing the TimeSaver
minutes. He stated he would like to see the minutes capture what occurred at the
meeting along with the recording the votes.
Reyes-Johnson discussed the process that was followed by TimeSaver to submit
minutes to City staff. She reported TimeSaver minutes would be submitted to City
Administrator Zikmund and Barb would forward these minutes to all Charter
Commission members for review. She indicated any technical errors should be
brought to Barb’s attention and any substantive issues would be addressed by the
Commission at the next meeting. Amundsen stated all technical changes would be
made to the minutes within a week or two. He commented on the high value of
TimeSaver having the minutes done in a timely manner while the meeting was still
fresh in the Commissioner’s minds.
Clawson asked if all other City commissions use TimeSaver. City Administrator
Zikmund reported this was the case and noted the same process for approving the
minutes was being proposed for the Charter Commission.
Clawson inquired if the secretary was required to keep minutes for the Commission
until the bylaws were amended. City Attorney Riggs reported the bylaws require
someone to take minutes and act as the secretary. He advised the Commission
could assign this task, at any time. He indicated he did not have any other
Commission he worked with that had a sitting member taking minutes. He
reported an outside agency allows for all members to be more fully involved in
meetings. He stated minutes were typically submitted in a draft form with
corrections being made by the group prior to receiving approval at the next
meeting. He explained that was the efficiency of working with an outside agency,
such as TimeSaver.
Amundsen indicated he was in favor of the trial with TimeSaver but stated he was
unclear about the processes that would be followed. He asked who would be
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Regular Meeting Page 6
responsible for making the technical changes to the meeting minutes. City
Administrator Zikmund reported this task would be completed by staff. He
indicated a substantive change would be made by the Commission at a meeting and
staff would amend the minutes to reflect the requested substantive change.
Amundsen stated he would be in favor of a three-meeting trial with TimeSaver to
see what the substantive differences were between the meeting minutes.
Thomas explained he could support the motion on the floor. He indicated this
group had copious minutes years ago when verbatim minutes were being provided
for each meeting. He discussed the amount of time it took the Commission to
review and approve these minutes. He stated after some time the Commission
agreed to reduce the level of detail that was included within the meeting minutes
and this was written into the bylaws. He reported TimeSaver was given no clear
direction on the March minutes and was doing more capturing of the events than
was preferred based on the history of the group. He stated going forward he
would like to see the minutes have less detail and less personal opinions.
Motion Approved
Review purpose, role and guiding principles.
Reyes-Johnson reviewed the purpose, role and guiding principles for the Commission
based on the discussion held at the March meeting. She requested feedback from the
group on how to proceed.
Thomas commented on the mission statement or purpose of the Charter that was approved
by this group in 2002. He asked if the Commission wanted to review the mission
statement, the purpose statement, or both.
Reyes-Johnson reported the Commission did not have a mission statement in the bylaws.
Amundsen stated he was confused and noted the mission statement does not capture the
duties intended by the statutes or responsibilities for this group.
Reyes-Johnson explained this was not intended to be a mission statement for the group but
rather was to clarify the purpose and role for the Charter Commission.
Warren thanked the Chair for creating a wonderful document and did not believe it was
necessary for the group to codify items that were common sense. For this reason, he
recommended the Commission let the statement stand as it was and that the group move
on to the next order of business.
Peterson questioned if the purpose or mission statement had to become part of the bylaws.
Thomas stated the statements were separate issues and were published in different areas.
He clarified the mission statement should remain separate and noted the purpose statement
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
Regular Meeting Page 7
could be made a part of the bylaws. He explained if an amendment to the bylaws was
being proposed a motion would be required. However, if the group was supporting the
valid purpose statement, consensus of the group would be adequate and no vote was
necessary.
Peterson indicated he supported the purpose statement and guiding principles for the
Charter Commission.
Klander supported the proposed purpose and guiding principles.
Thomas asked if it would benefit the Commission to vote on the guiding principles as a
code of conduct for the group. City Attorney Riggs stated the Commission could take this
action.
Motion by J. Thomas, seconded by J. Klander, to recommend the Commission
adopt the purpose, role and guiding principles as written.
Peterson recommended that the document be amended to state every effort will be
made to complete Charter Commission meetings in 90 minutes.
Amundsen suggested a friendly amendment that the last bullet be reworded to read
meetings will generally be conducted in 90 minutes.
Klander stated he supported the language as is noting this was a code of conduct
that the Commission would be supporting. City Attorney Riggs commented the
City Council had a drop-dead time of 10:00 p.m. and if a meeting were to reach
this time a motion could be made to extend the meeting. He suggested the
Commission proceed in this manner.
Thomas recommended the language read a significant effort will be made to hold
the meeting in 90 minutes. He supported the recommendation of the City Attorney
that a motion be made if meetings need to be extended for more than 90 minutes.
Amendment motion by J. Thomas, seconded by B. Amundsen, to recommend
language of the guiding principles be slightly amended to read a significant effort
will be made to hold the meeting in 90 minutes.
Amendment Approved 8-1 (Clawson opposed)
Amended Motion Approved 8-1 (Clawson opposed)
Reyes-Johnson explained she was concerned about time and suggested the group discuss
Establishing a Meeting Time next.
Motion by M. Reyes-Johnson, seconded by J. Klander, to discuss Establish
Meeting Time next.
Motion Approved
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New Business
Establish meeting time.
Reyes-Johnson reported the group does not have any agreement regarding meeting time.
She noted some members wanted to move the meeting time earlier, which others did not
support. She asked when Commissioner Erickson was available to meet.
Erickson reported he would be available to meet any time.
Klander thanked Chair Reyes-Johnson for gathering comments from the group and
providing the Commission with a summary on this topic. He noted he would prefer to
meet earlier.
Staples stated he too would prefer to meet earlier than 7:00 p.m.
Reyes-Johnson asked if 7:00 p.m. would work as an established meeting time for the
group or if this had to change.
Thomas explained he preferred to continue meeting at 7:00 p.m. He commented he could
make a 6:30 p.m. start time work.
Clawson indicated he could support a 6:30 p.m. start time.
Peterson reported 6:30 p.m. would not be ideal for him but stated he could make this
work.
Reyes-Johnson asked if there was enough support to adjust the meeting start time.
Motion by B. Staples, seconded by J. Thomas, to adjust the meeting start time to
6:30 p.m.
Motion Approved
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by J. Peterson, to extend the meeting to 9:00
p.m. or no later than 9:15 p.m. in order to allow the Commission to address the
remaining items on the agenda.
Clawson recommended the remaining items under Unfinished Business be tabled to
the July meeting.
Thomas stated he believed it would be in the Charter Commission’s best interest to
take action on these items at this meeting.
Clawson stated he would withdraw recommendation.
Motion Approved 5-4 (Klander, Reyes-Johnson, Staples and Warren opposed)
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Unfinished Business
Process for Chapter 4.
Reyes-Johnson reported this item was addressed under her report. She asked if the
Commission needed further information regarding this item.
Warren stated he would like a concise comment from staff regarding this item. City
Administrator Zikmund reported the City Council has directed staff to work with the City
Attorney to draft language for Chapter for, for 18 months. The Council would be
adopting an Ordinance that would come before the Charter Commission recognizing the
work completed by the Commission in the past 22 months.
Further discussion ensued regarding the process that would be followed to approve
revisions of Chapter 4.
Reyes-Johnson asked if the current Chapter 4 would be provided to City Attorney Riggs.
City Administrator Riggs reported the direction from City Council was to have City
Attorney Riggs rewrite Chapter 4 with the goal of simplifying and incorporating the 18-
month election language.
Amundsen questioned if an Ordinance was proposed by the City and sent to the Charter
Commission, the Commission has 60 days to review this to send back information to the
Council. He expressed concern with timeline. He suggested the Commission draft
language in conjunction with the City Attorney and that this language be forwarded to the
City Council for feedback versus the other way around.
Motion by B. Amundsen, seconded by R. Warren, to recommend the Chapter 4
language discussed at the January 29, 2019 Charter Commission meeting be
forwarded to the City Attorney, be reviewed and returned to this body with the 18-
month language.
City Administrator Zikmund reported the Commission could take this action, but
noted the City Council may not feel bound by this action.
City Attorney Riggs explained he disagreed with Amundsen’s statement noting he
was not recommending this change come from the City Council as an Ordinance,
rather it was a request from the City Council that the Charter Commission would
review a language amendment.
Warren commented the City Attorney would be drafting language based on the 18-
month recommendation from the City Council and noted the Charter Commission
had been leaning towards 14 months. He asked why staff would be drafting an
Ordinance with 18 months when the Charter Commission supported 14 months.
He reiterated that the Charter Commission had not approved anything.
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
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City Attorney Riggs reviewed the process that must be followed and noted a
unanimous approval from the City Council was necessary and the Council currently
supported 18 months.
City Administrator Zikmund discussed the recent State law change and explained it
made no sense to him for the Charter Commission to debate this topic if there was
not Council consensus. For this reason, he placed the item on a recent Council
worksession agenda and the Council requested 18 months.
Warren reported the Council can request 18 months, but noted the Charter
Commission, in its wisdom could make a recommendation of 14 months. If this
were to happen, this issue would be at an impasse.
Motion by J. Thomas, seconded by B. Amundsen, to amend the motion on the
floor to understand the City Attorney will draft Chapter 4 to reflect the 18-month
language as well as the other items discussed by the Charter Commission.
Reyes-Johnson stated she did not believe it was necessary for the Charter
Commission to take this action.
Thomas withdrew his amendment.
Motion Approved 8-1 (Reyes-Johnson opposed)
Warren questioned if the City Attorney would have a document for the Commission to
review by July 16th. City Attorney Riggs stated he would have the document prepared
prior to July 16th.
Recognize participants in revisions of Chapter 4.
Reyes-Johnson thanked all of the members on that assisted in revising Chapter 4. She
stated she appreciated the efforts of former Commission Member Oberg, along with the
input she received from the current Charter Commission members.
New Business
Review Secretaries Duties and Processes.
Amundsen stated he asked for this item to be clarified because of a concern he had related
to processes. He provided the Commission with a handout and explained he had been a
member of the Charter Commission for a number of years. He indicated he broke out the
duties of the secretary from the bylaws and discussed these in further detail with the
Commission. He stated as a practical implementation of these duties he took notes at each
meeting, recorded motions and votes, and prepared minutes from his notes. He explained
he also prepares other documents per the Commission’s request, unless the task was
assigned to staff. He reported he then contacts the chair to see if any modifications are
needed. He described the process he followed when forwarding his meeting minutes to
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
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staff and stated there was nothing that would preclude him from working with staff in
terms of documents. He explained back in 2005, the Commission determined the secretary
would maintain all documents for the group. He indicated after each meeting he makes
corrections to the minutes or any other documents and forwards these documents to City
staff for posting. He commented these were the practical processes he has followed for
years. He reported that if these processes were to change since the Commission would
now be using TimeSaver, he would need to modify his processes. He stated he was
willing to prepare the minutes, but noted he was also willing to let someone else do this
work.
Warren asked if having this service conflicted with Charter Commission bylaws.
Amundsen stated he would still view the video when completing his minutes. He indicated
the only difference would be the information from TimeSaver may be provided quicker
than his minutes and the changes to TimeSaver minutes would run through staff. He
explained he was seeking clarification on the process that would be followed going
forward.
Warren questioned if direction had been provided through the action taken earlier in this
meeting.
Amundsen stated he was seeking clarification given the fact he was not provided access to
the TimeSaver minutes when a request was made of City staff.
Warren questioned what Amundsen was trying to accomplish.
Amundsen explained he was trying to seek input on the process and duties that will be
followed for the secretary.
City Attorney Riggs commented on the duties of the chair versus the duties of the
secretary. He indicated all adopted records were to be managed by the secretary but all
other documents first go to the chair. He noted the chair was responsible for setting an
agenda and documents would therefore be forwarded to the chair and would not go
through the secretary.
Amundsen thanked the City Attorney for sharing his opinion. He explained the secretary
has always prepared the documents, since the inception after the Charter. He reported the
rights of the chair within the bylaws says the chair will call the meeting, prepares the
agenda, presides at the meetings, oversees the implementation of the decisions of the
Commission, forwards any action for archive and acts as the primary liaison with City
staff. He stated this does not preclude the secretary from also acting as a primary liaison,
nor does it exclude the secretary from forwarding minutes. He indicated this has been the
practice of the Commission since 2002.
City Attorney Riggs advised he did not read in these documents that it was the secretary’s
duties to prepare resolutions and language modifications.
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Amundsen stated he appreciated this opinion; however, this was a Commission discussion.
Warren asked if he wanted to bring a Resolution forward would he pass this along to the
secretary.
Amundsen explained this could be done.
City Attorney Riggs reported this information should be forwarded to the Charter
Commission Chair.
Warren expressed frustration with the fact Amundsen was bringing a problem before the
Commission that was not a problem.
Amundsen indicated a problem was generated when he was not given access to the
TimeSaver minutes until he received the document from the chair. He was simply told the
process had been changed.
Warren encouraged the chair, secretary and staff to work through this issue.
Amundsen stated this issue had not been worked out and that was why he was requesting
support from the Commission on the process that should be followed.
City Attorney Riggs explained he had spoken to Amundsen numerous times over the past
15 to 17 years. He was of the opinion Amundsen was searching for a problem that did not
exist. He indicated this issue could be worked out easily by dividing out the roles. He
reported the secretary had record keeping tasks and was responsible for sending reports
onto the chief judge per the chair’s direction. He reported the goals of the Charter
Commission were approved by the entire Commission, same as the minutes.
Thomas noted he was the oldest and longest serving member on the Commission. He
explained he agreed with the City Attorney on this matter in that there was not a problem,
but rather there was a miscommunication with the TimeSaver minutes. He indicated
further clarification should have been made regarding what was meant by a “trial”. He
believed the group head enough clarification at this time and encouraged everyone to
move forward.
Reyes-Johnson asked, according to the bylaws, who was to prepare the agenda. City
Attorney Riggs reported the bylaws strictly state the chair was to prepare the agenda.
Reyes-Johnson expressed concern with the fact Amundsen did not send out her agenda for
the March meeting, but rather sent out his own agenda.
Amundsen stated he sent out the agenda in a form that was typically followed by the
Commission, with all of the chair’s items included. He concluded that all of his actions
and duties will remain the same until the Commission works out what to do with
TimeSaver. He interprets “prepare the records of the Commission” to mean any
documents the Commission has been working with, which has been the case since 2002.
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Mounds View Charter Commission May 21, 2019
Regular Meeting Page 13
City Attorney Riggs commented if the chair were to submit an agenda this does not have
to go through the secretary.
Amundsen thanked the City Attorney for his opinion on this matter.
Meeting Dates for Remainder of 2019.
Warren recommended no future meeting dates be set at this time.
Peterson stated he had the understanding all meeting dates had to be set for the remainder
of the year per the bylaws. City Attorney Riggs reported the Charter Commission did not
have to have a set meeting schedule in place. He noted the chair and two other members
could call a special meeting, which could be posted. He indicated the Commission did not
have to adopt a Resolution this evening with regard to setting meeting dates for the
remainder of 2019.
Thomas explained the Commission has set a meeting date for July.
Set Next Meeting Agenda Items.
This item was not addressed.
7.Next Regular Meeting:Tuesday, July 16, 2019 at 6:30 p.m.
8.Adjournment: Meeting adjourned at 9:06 p.m.
Transcribed by:
Heidi Guenther
TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc.
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