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Document: PL AGENDA 07191988
C 2 TY OF S T _ ANTHONY
P LANN 2 N G COMM 2 S S 2 ON M=NUTS S
.TULY. 1 9 , 1- 988
1 The meeting was opened at 7: 30 P.M. with the Pledge of Allegiance led
2 by Chair Wagner.
3 ROLL CALL
4 Present for roll call : London, Franzese., Hansen, Wagner, Werenicz ,
5 Madden.
6 Absent: Brownell.
7 Also present: David Childs, City Manager.
8 JUNE 19, 1988 PLANNING COlGUSSION MIAiUTES
9 Motion by Madden, seconded by London to approve with the following
10 changes:
• 11 Page 3 , line 9: Insert space between "Drumm" and "in" .
12 Page 8, line 2: Insert "that" between "recommend" and "the
13 Council" .
14 Page 9, line 13 : Substitute "though" for "thought" .
15 motion carried unanimously.
16 Commissioner London Will Represent Planning Commission at Council's
17 July 26th Meeting
18 PUBLIC HEARINGS
19 Commission United in Recommending Conditional Use Permit for Kuelbs
20 Motorcycle Sales and Accessories Store
21 At 7:35 P.M. Chair Wagner read the notice of the hearing on the above
22 which had been published in the July 6th Bulletin and sent to all
23 property owners of record within 350 feet of the subject property at
24 2519-21 Harding Street N.E. No one present reported failure to
25 receive the notice or objected to its content.
26 Commissioners had been provided copies of the Application for
27 Conditional Use Permit submitted by Leo Kuelbs as well as his
28 original application letter and the minutes of the City Council and
29 Planning Commission meetings on the matter.
1
• Staff Report
2 Mr. Childs reiterated portions of his June 25th memorandum to the
3 Commissioners, including the fact that the Ordinance amending the
4 Zoning Code to allow the use as a permitted conditional use would be
5 given its third reading for adoption July 26th, the same night as the
6 Council will be considering the permit. The City Manager also
7 reiterated that he had received no calls or letters either for or
8 against the permit from the neighboring property owners.
9 Mr. Childs advised the Commissioners that it was now their right and
10 responsibility to attach recommended conditions to the permit. He
11 suggested that the Council tended to look carefully at the impact such
12 an activity might have on the surrounding neighborhood, specifically
13 as to hours of operation, noise, etc.
14 Proponents - Leo and Joe Kuelbs, 8545 Highway 101, Savage, MN
15 Joe Kuelbs:
16 *reiterated that the Kuelbs family had been in the Harley-
17 Davidson business for 15 years during which time they have had stores
18 in two communities and had "no problems with previous dealerships", as
19 indicated in their June 15th letter;
*told Chair Wagner their current shop in Savage is located
within an eighth of a mile of at least 50 homes as well as a campground
22 and there have been no problems whatsoever with any of the residents;
23 *reported the City of Savage has placed no restrictions on their
24 operations and they anticipate keeping the same hours of operation in
25 St. Anthony as for their Savage dealership;
26 *indicated he would probably be advising customers through maps
27 on the flyers and in the Yellow Pages to approach his business from
28 Highway 88 rather than Kenzie Terrace;
29 *said demonstration rides can only be given during seasons when
30 the weather is good. Because of the restrictions they place on the
31 riders for their own protection, he would anticipate only between 50
32. and 100 test rides to be allowed in any single year;
33 *reported that state law forbids selling licensable vehicles on
34 Sunday so they aren't open that day;
35 *told Commissioner Franzese the proposed St. Anthony space is
36 only half the size of their Savage operation and this dealership would
37 probably not have as many customers. However, he woµld expect to see
38 about a hundred people go through the store on a. busy day,' only half
39 of whom would be coming to the store on a motorcycle;
• 2
1 *added that noise levels are regulated by the EPA so all new
motorcycles (which is primarily what they sell) are very quiet;
3 *didn't deny that there could be motorcycles with loud,
4 def ective muf f lers just as there are cars; or that there might be a
5 few of them which would be serviced in St. Anthony;
6 *expects to put up a neon face type sign Harley Davidson puts out
7 which will be about 16 feet long and 2 or 3 feet high and would be
8 lit during the hours of operation, which Mr. Childs has said would be
9 well within the City sign ordinance;
10 *would also want to have some type of security light at night;
11 *told the Chair the primary services they would offer at this
12 location would be setting up and servicing of new motorcycles and minor
13 tuning up of new and used cycles;
14 *there would be minimum of repair of exhaust systems with all
15 major repair work done in the Savage shop;
16 *assured Commissioner London that there would be no outside
17 repair or storage of vehicles.
18 There was no one present to speak for or against the permit and the
19 Chair closed the hearing at 7:52 P.M. after Mr. Childs had cautioned
the Commissioners that it would not be appropriate for the City to
46 mandate traffic across other businesses' property.
22 Commission Recommendation
23 Motion by Franzese, seconded by Madden to recommend the City Council
24 grant a Conditional Use Permit to Leo and Joe Kuelbs, Twin City Harley-
25 Davidson, for a motorcycle sales and accessory shop at 2519-21 Harding
26 Street N.E. , which is not to include major repair services. In
27 recommending that this permit be granted, the Commission also
28 recommends the permit be made contingent upon annual review by staff
29 on the basis of excessive complaints about the operation.
30 The Commission recommends further that the business be required to:
31 1. maintain the same hours of operation as their Savage shop,
32 namely:
33 9:00 A.M. to 8:00 P.M. , Monday through Thursday and 9:00 A.M.
34 to 5:00 P.M. , Friday and Saturday;
35 2 . encourage test drivers to use Highway 88;
36 3 . provide all services and displays within the building with no
37 outside storage;
3
• 1 4. do only setting up and minor repairs at the St. Anthony
2 location with all major jobs done elsewhere.
3 In recommending the permit be granted, the Planning Commission finds
4 that:
5' a. The proposed conditional use meets all three conditions which
6 have to be satisfied before a conditional use may be authorized.
7 b. No opposition to the permit was registered during the hearing.
8 c. The applicants have been made aware of the City concerns
9 related to access in light of nearby residences.
10 Notion carried unanimously.
11 Neighbor Opposition Leads to 5 to 1 Vote Against Garage Addition at
12 4029 Penrod Lane
13 At 8:05 P.M. the Chair read aloud the notice of the hearing on the
14 request from Eugene B. Tomas for a variance from setback requirements
15 of the Zoning Ordinance to allow addition of a new garage immediately
16 east of the existing garage on the Silver Lane side of this corner
17 lot. No one present reported failure to receive the notice which had
18 been published in the July 6th Bulletin and sent to all property
• 19 owners of record within 200 feet of the subject property, or objected
20 to its content.
21 Documentation
22 The agenda packet included copies of the City Manager's July 25th
23 memorandum on the request; the Variance Petition; and three scaled
24 drawings of the proposed 32 foot X 24 foot garage addition; a second
25 story bedroom addition on the existing garage; and a family room
26 which Mr. Tomas said he planned to convert the existing garage to
27 once his boys have grown up and moved away.
28 Staff Report
29 Kr. Childs reiterated the following from his memorandum:
30 *the existing home and garage were constructed by Mr. Tomas in
31 1966 under a variance issued in July of 1966 for a setback of 11
32 feet from the property line on Silver Lane, where the Ordinance
33 requires 30 feet;
34 *the addition would maintain the same alignment with the
35 existing garage and would therefore require the -same size variance;
36 *Mr. Tomas had been advised to discuss his proposal with his
• 4
1 neighbors before the hearing and to date staff had received no
• 2 letters or calls from any of them.
3 The City Manager also indicated he had looked up the minutes of the
4 meeting in 1966 where the first variance had been granted but ,found
5 only four lines related to the issue. Information about the
6 reasons . used by the Commission and Council for granting the
7 variance were not in those minutes.
8 Proponents - Eugene and Nicole Tomas
9 Nr. Tomas told the Commissioners:
10 *he had four sons, all of whom had licenses and cars so he
11 needed more garage space, even though he had never been able to park
12 cars in the existing garage since it had been built;
13 *the plan was to construct the new three car garage which would
14 exit on Silver Lane; put a second floor bedroom on the existing
15 garage this fall for the use of his mother during winter months; and
16 to continue to use the garage, which exits onto Penrod, for that
17 purpose until his sons had moved away from home. He said he then
18 planned to enclose it for a family room;
19 *there's a lot of congestion in the yard now with 7 cars
20 (including the vans used for his plumbing business and a boat) and
• 21 his mother will have a car to park in the winter;
22 *he preferred adding the new garage to the existing structure
23 but understood he could put a detached garage with a 30 foot setback
24 in his backyard but thought that would look "kind of ugly" compared
25 to the appearance of an attached garage fit into the rest of the main
26 structure;
27 *he had been forced to cut down the existing garage size to
28 meet the Ordinance requirements in 1966 and the way the house is now
29 with a sliding door on that side, if he continued the garage on the
30 house side, he wouldn't be able to get a large car into his garage.
31 The plan was therefore designed to come back off the garage and then
32 to -encircle the deck two feet before continuing out towards the back;
33 *the third stall would probably only be long enough to use as a
34 "lawn mower stall";
35 *he would probably keep the cement slab which runs the length
36 of the existing garage on the Silver Lane side;
37 *he would retain at least a 38 foot setback to the rear with
38 the proposed addition;
39
• 5
1 *Don Zebro down the block who had put in the original footings
• 2 would be consulted regarding the adequacies of footings and the depth
3 to frost for putting on a second story and he knew he would probably
4 have to double the studs for that addition;
5 *the elevations of Silver Lane would determine the floor height
6 of his new garage.
7 Opponent - Delite E. Hogan, 4024 Penrod Lane (across the street to
8 the southwest of the Tomas house)
9 No. Hogan told the Commissioners:
10 *from what she had observed, "Mr. Tomas for all intents and
11 purposes, was operating a plumbing business out of his home and
12 still has three vans which are never in the garage because "their
13 business stuff is all in the garage and is loaded every morning;
14 *their cars are all over the driveway and the streets;
15 *the neighborhood is losing its residential status because the
16 people who live to the left of her repair cars and also have cars
17 parked all over;
18 *another neighbor down the line has his business in his home
19 as well;
• 20 *she had lived there only three years but couldn't believe what
21 is going on there;
22 *she doesn't want to live in a neighborhood like this one and
23 questioned why these activities were allowed;
24 *she believed property values would go down if the City
25 continued to let these businesses operate in a residential area.
26 The complainant told Commissioner Franzese it appeared to her that
27 the Tomas vans were intended for business use. She said cars are
28 brought all the time to the house next door for sanding, painting,
29 etc. which she was certain was not allowed in a residential
30 neighborhood. When Commissioner Hansen asked whether she had
31 complained to the City, she told him she was constantly calling about
32 the dogs running loose in the neighborhood and was "tired of
33 calling. " She said the only reason she was at the hearing was
34 because she was worried that with the addition, the Tomas business
35 was going to be expanded.
36 Hansen told the complainant the Commission's purpose that evening
37 was not to enforce the Ordinance which forbids running a business
38 out of a home, but only to consider a variance for a garage
39 addition.
• 6
1 Radden disputed this conclusion, saying he certainly thought the
• 2 implication that Mr. Tomas was running a business out of his garage
3 was certainly relevant to the request for another garage before the
4 Commission that evening.
5 Childs told Ms. Hogan it was very difficult for the City to enforce
6 animal violations and it was therefore imperative to build a case of
7 continued violations. He urged her not to worry about "becoming a
8 pest" but to continue calling.
9 Proponent Rebuttal -
10 Mr. Tomas indicated:
11 *he had been self-employed in the plumbing business ever since
12 he moved to that neighborhood in 1966;
13 *he does take calls at home and he and his third son, who works
14 for him, do drive their vehicles home every night just the same as
15 any working people do;
16 *he didn't see any difference between himself and a self-
17 employed attorney who takes calls at home and carries a brief case
18 home at night;
19 *at the present he has no outside help but did have a man
• 20 working for him full time in the past;
21 *Don Zebro, his neighbor, has a four car garage into which he
22 drives his truck and closes the door and "nobody knows he has a
23 business there" ;
24 *he guessed a third of .the people on that street were also
25 self-employed;
26 *no one comes to buy anything from him;
27 *one of the vans which the family uses for camping is utilized
28 on occasion for his wife to go to the supply house and bring whatever
29 he needs on the job to him;
30 *some of the supplies are kept in the garage but most are kept
31 in his van;
32 *it was true that every day a delivery was made to him on the
33 job site but otherwise his equipment stays in the vehicle;
34 *the exception is those materials aren't used up on a job which
35 are stored in the garage for awhile;
36 *he didn't think the van was loaded and unloaded every day;
• 7
t
1 *one of the three vans he has now would be eliminated soon
• 2 because of its appearance.
3 Tomas denied the new garage addition was related to an expansion of
4 his plumbing business although it was conceivable that he would be
5 doing the loading and unloading in there after it's built. He said
6 primarily he wanted to have room to store his boat which he has had
7 to leave outdoors the last two winters.
8 The applicant said he perceived by parking half of his vehicles on
9 the Silver Lane side he would be relieving Penrod Lane. He
10 admitted it was "a jungle" around his house when there's no parking
11 on the street in the winter, but anticipated most of the congestion
12 would be eliminated when the boys moved away.
13 Childs indicated there might be a problem if vehicles were parked on
14 the proposed Silver Lane cement slab which is in the City's right-
15 of-way because that's where the City crews have to plow snow.
16 Nineteen foot vans would also protrude beyond the 11 foot setback he
17 observed.
18 Tomas responded that there might be more room to park some of the
19 vehicles with the new garage addition.
20 Two other persons were present but neither accepted the invitation
21 to speak and the hearing was closed at 8: 35 P.M.
• 22 commission Reaction
23 London
24 *said he basically opposed the variance because he perceived
25 the neighbor's objections to be legitimate;
26 *indicated he believed Mr. Tomas was running a plumbing
27 business out of his garage and if only the boat were going to be
28 parked in the new garage, the addition would do little to alleviate
29 the problems for the neighbors with the number of cars which would be
30 left sitting outside;
31 *concluded that as long as Mr. Tomas runs a business out of
32 his garage and uses two or three vans for that purpose, he's going to
33 have parking problems;
34 *indicated he had a detached garage himself and didn't
35 necessarily consider them to be either "ugly" or "inconvenient" ;
36 *said in many ways they are advantageous with their long
37 driveways and in this case Mr. Tomas might be able to store some of
38 his belongings out back where no one cares.
• 8
1 The Commissioner told the other Commissioners the applicant had not
• 2 presented arguments convincing enough to get him to recommend a
3 variance. He said he perceived in cases like this one, the neighbor
4 concerns had to be taken into account because they have a lot of
5 money invested in their homes. Commissioner London didn't think the
6 City should be encouraging lowering property values by allowing
7 businesses to operate out of homes.
8 Later on, Commissioner London reiterated that it was pretty obvious tD
9 him that Mr. Tomas was running his plumbing business out of his home
10 and that fact had to be considered when the Commission made a
11 decision. He told the other Commissioners, based on his own
12 experience with a one car garage he had decided a long time ago that
13 he was going to vote affirmatively for any request for a two car
14 garage but he perceived a different issue was involved here where
15 "there were too many people and too many cars" for the site size
16 where he didn't think granting a variance for another garage would do
17 much to alleviate the problems.
18 Wagmer indicated the only reason he was even considering
19 recommending the variance was because he wondered whether a second
20 garage might help the current situation.
21 Hanse indicated he was not opposed to the variance for a number of
22 reasons. He perceived the issue of whether the applicant is running
23 a business out of his home was not what the Commission was supposed
• 24 to decide. The Commissioner pointed out that they had heard from
25 only one neighbor who lived across the street even though the
26 neighbor to the east was the most affected.
27 Commissioner Hansen added that Mr. Tomas can build a detached garage
28 without a variance and said, given the lay of the land and the
29 proximity to the neighbors, he wasn't certain the second garage
30 wouldn't be more of an obstruction in the backyard. He personally
31 believed an attached garage added more continuity to the property
32 than if it were built in the backyard so close the neighbor's.
33 The Commissioner commented that he didn't think Mr. Tomas driving a
34 van he uses for his work home every night was any different than his
35 carrying his brief case out and into his home every day.
36 He argued that by granting the variance for another garage, the City
37 might be getting some vehicles off the street which was the goal of
38 the ordinance the Council recently passed and he "assumed was going
39 to be enforced" . In response to comments about too many cars on the
40 site, Commissioner Hansen indicated he perceived the Commission was
41 trying to make a decision related to the number of cars which can be
42 parked at a residence, which the Council hadn't even been able to
43 come to grips with when they passed the ordinance allowing parking
44 only on paved surfaces.
• 9
1 Madden indicated that, although he now knew the ordinance had nothing
• 2 to say about it, was still concerned about adding another curb cut on
3 Silver Lane. He said there are only 8 curb cuts in 85 one
4 hundredths of a mile on the south side of that street in St. Anthony,
5 whereas Penrod Lane, which is three tenths of a mile, has 15 curb
6 cuts on the east side, indicating to him that Penrod is a better
7 street to have curb cuts than Silver Lane which is such a high
8 volume traffic street.
9 The Commissioner said he had nothing positive to say about the
10 request and instead perceived the problem to be that Mr. tomas'
11 property was just not large enough to accommodate all the vehicles, a
12 trailer and a boat, and the "various and sundry junk he has laying
13 around there. " Commissioner Madden questioned what use the applicant
14 would make of his new garage if he doesn't use the one he has now
15 for parking cars. He agreed_ with Commissioner London that the
16 Commission had to take into account the report of a neighbor who is
17 there every day.
18 Werenaaz said he had no strong feelings either way but was leaning
19 towards denial. He sympathized with the neighbor but wondered if
20 another garage might not clear up her view of the property. The
21 Commissioner said he was more concerned about the new garage
22 encroaching on the neighbor's property to the east.
23 Commissioner Werenicz indicated he doubted whether the first
24 question in the application should have been answered in the
• 25 affirmative because he could see no "undue hardship" but rather "an
26 inconvenience" would result "should the ordinance be strictly
27 enforced. "
28 agreed, saying he personally had some reservations about
29 whether any of the three questions deserved an affirmative answer.
30 He said his only reason for considering a recommendation for
31 granting the variance would be that it might help to decrease the
32 number of vehicles in the yard.
33 nanzese reiterated that she thought a wrap around garage might add
34 to the appearance of this property more than a detached garage. She
35 reported another house with two garages in her own neighborhood which
36 looked very good. However, she also wondered whether three more
. 37 stalls would do much to alleviate the problem since the applicant had
38 testified he didn't use the existing garage to park any of the
39 vehicles which are all over the lot now.
40 The Commissioner said she had three children driving and another
41 about to drive and could sympathize with Mr. Tomas's situation, but
42 at the same time she had always been aware of her neighbor's rights
43 and had tried not to be a nuisance.
44 Hansen reiterated that the Commission was not considering a
45 conditional use permit with this request and said he didn't consider
• 10
1 it was up to the Commission to decide how this garage was going to be
used anymore than any other garage in St. Anthony. Based on the
41 request from this individual, Commissioner Hansen didn't believe the
4 neighbor's comments should impact on the , Commission's decision. He
5 repeated that the City had an ordinance which should be enforced if
6 there's actually a business being run out of this property. He
7 indicated he had driven past the house four times himself and had
8 never seen the number of vehicles other Commissioners reported seeing
9 parked there. Because he hadn't seen any, Commissioner Hansen said
10 he had to assume "somebody was doing a good job keeping all those
11 vehicles from blocking traffic or from parking on the grass. "
12 The Commissioner concluded that if this individual was willing to spend
13 money in an attempt to alleviate his problems "and since this is only
14 an extension of a use the City granted a variance for 22 years ago" ,
15 he was ready to recommend that the variance be granted.
16 Commission Recommendation
17 Motion by Hansen, seconded by Werenicz to recommend the City Council
18 grant the request from Eugene B. Tomas for a variance from the setback
19 requirements of the Zoning Ordinance to allow a 32 foot X 24 foot
20 addition to the east side of the existing garage at 4029 Penrod Lane,
21 in alignment with the existing garage. The variance would allow an 11
22 foot setback from the Silver Lane property line where the ordinance
23 requires 30 feet.
• In recommending the variance be granted, the Commission finds that:
25 1. The three conditions required by statute to be satisfied
26 affirmatively are met in terms of what the City normally accepts.
27 2. The variance seems logical in light of recent ordinance changes
28 designed to discourage outdoor parking.
29 3 . The proposed variance is merely an extension of the one granted
30 for the property when it was first built in 1966.
31 4. Were the City to deny the variance, the homeowner could still
32 build a detached garage which might, in fact, be less desirable for
33 the neighbors.
34 5. Although one neighbor spoke against the variance, it was because
35 she thought a business was being run out of the home which is a
36 separate issue from the variance.
37 Voting on the Motion:
38 Aye: Hansen.
39 Nay: London, Franzese, Wagner, Madden, Werenicz.
40 Motion not carried.
11
• 1 The Chair commented that he perceived the Commission recommendation
2 had to be for denial since the above had been so clearly defeated.
3 Franzese told Commissioner Hansen that "without all the qualifiers
4 you put on the motion, I could have voted for the variance because I
5 agreed that it was just an extension of the one the City granted in
6 1966 and the addition wouldn't change the existing building
7 alignment.
8 Nagner and Werenicz indicated they continued to have problems with
9 the answers on the application.
10 Application Withdrawn
11 Mr. Tomas stated that he was just going to apply for a building
12 permit for a detached garage and he hoped "the Commission would be
13 happy with all those vehicles parked on the street and around the
14 yard. " The Chair advised him that sometimes the Council reverses the
15 Commission recommendation. The applicant left muttering some
16 uncomplimentary phrases about his neighbor.
17 OTHER BUSINESS
18 Commissioners Invited to Attend Carbon Filtration Dedication
19 Mr. Childs indicated they would all be welcome to attend the ceremony
• 20 at the site at 6:00 P.M. , July 26, 1988, where the City's "Clean
21 Water" would be toasted with that beverage instead of champagne.
22 New Operators to Remove the Controversial Roof Sian on Mickey D's
23 Restaurant
24 The Manager reported the new proprietor had told him he wanted to
25 keep the name because of its customer perception about good food
26 being served there. In addition to removing the controversial sign
27 from the roof, Mr. Childs indicated the new restaurant owner was
28 going to apply for two signs, one in the front and the other on the
29 side facing St. Anthony Boulevard, the total of which would not
30 exceed what the City allowed that building. However, he would be
31 willing to keep only the front sign if that was the City's decision.
32 Apartment Project and Transfer of Parkview Appear to be Realities
33 Before the meeting adjourned, the City Manager gave a brief report
34 on what was happening in conjunction with both projects. He said he
35 expects Lang-Nelson to be named the developer for the third phase of
36 the Kenzie Terrace Redevelopment Project at the next Council meeting
37 and anticipates the closing on the Parkview building to be held the
38 first week in August unless environmental problems crop up to
39 make that purchase unfeasible.
• 12
1 ADrTOURI�II�SNT
• 2 Motion by Madden, seconded by Wagner to adjourn the meeting at 9: 35
3 P.M.
4 Motion carried unanimously.
5 Respectfully submitted,
6 Helen Crowe, Secretary
7 :cjk
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