HomeMy WebLinkAboutPL MINUTES 11161993 Meeting Sheet
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Box: 19
Folder: PL MINUTES AND AGENDAS 1993
Document: PL MINUTES 11161993
I CITY OF ST. ANTHONY
102
3 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
4
5 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
6
7
8 I. CALL TO ORDER/PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
9
10 The meeting was called to order at 7:00 p.m. and the Pledge of Allegiance was led by
11 Chair Faust.
12
13 H. ROLL CALL.
14
15 Commissioners present: Bergstrom, Thompson, Franzese, Gondorchin, Faust,
16 Madden, and Makowske
17
18 Staff present: City Manager Burt, Assistant Sarah Bellefuil
19
20 Also present: David Ewald representing Goodyear
21
22 III. APPROVAL OF THE OCTOBER 1993 PLANNING COMMISSION.
403
4 Motion by Commissioner Franzese and seconded by Commissioner Madden to
25 approve the minutes of the October 19, 1993 Planning Commission Meeting with the
26 following corrections:
27
28 Page 2, Line 17: The last sentence "A public hearing will be required for the
29 relocating of an accessory building" to include "if not in compliance with required set
30 backs". The City Manager corrected this by informing Commissioner Franzese that
31 anytime you relocate a building, including a shed or garage, now you have to have a
32 public hearing.
33
34 Page 3, Lines 17-18: Commissioner Gondorchin had asked Ms. Owen if she had any
35 previous experience operating this sort of business and also if the employee would be
36 hers or if this was leased space or arrangement. She stated that she had no previous
37 experience and that employee was hers. The Commissioner wanted that added for the
38 record.
39
40 Page 7, Lines 38-40: Commissioner Franzese inquired regarding the sentence "Bauer
41 noted when this building was built zero lot lines did not exist." The City Manager
42 indicated it was a factual statement and our ordinance to date still doesn't exist with
43 zero lot lines excepting commercial zones.
44
45
0
PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
6 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 2
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5
6 Page 4, Line 39: Commissioner Gondorchin questioned the statement of Staff
7 recommending a variance to zero feet. The City Manager indicated it was a correct
8 statement because it is the old Coolidge that goes through so it is right on the property
9 line.
10
11 Page 12, Line 14: The City Manager defined "The Alliance" as "a company."
12
13 Page 12, Line 19: Commissioner Franzese inquired regarding the City Manager's
14 statement that letters regarding this hearing were sent to all those who currently use
15 community center space. The City Manager indicated letters were sent to everyone
16 including individuals and organizations who used the space.
17
18 Motion carried unanimously.
19
20 IV. DESIGNATION OF COMMISSION REPRESENTATIVE TO CITY COUNCIL'S
21 DECEMBER 13, 1993 MEETING.
22
Commissioner Gondorchin will attend the December 13, 1993 City Council Meeting
4 representing the Planning Commission.
25
26 V. PUBLIC HEARINGS.
27
28 The public hearing was opened at 7:07 p.m. There was a notice of the public hearing
29 sign variance in the November 3, 1993 edition of the Bulletin.
30
31 A. Goodyear Auto Service Center, 4020 Silver Lake Road; sign variance
32 request.
33
34 David Ewald appeared on behalf of Goodyear Auto Service Center located 4020 Silver
35 Lake Road.
36
37 The City Manager explained the applicant was requesting three variances for two signs.
38 The original request appeared that they were actually going to ask for four variances
39 for an additional sign on the rear of the building. However the rear of the building
40 faces some garages where it wouldn't be seen and the plans were developed out of
41 Ohio where they weren't familiar with the site so they did omit one. The first variance
42 is for an additional wall sign. They have one wall sign on the building right now that
43 says "Goodyear Certified Auto Service" and they would like an additional sign above
the showroom. That existing sign is 89 sq. ft. They want additional 52 sq. ft. It still
5 would be under the total allowable sign surface area which is 150
1PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
02 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 3
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5 square feet. Proof of hardship must be met to allow an additional front wall sign.
6 Goodyear also wants to replace the existing ground sign. The plans for the ground
7 sign under the current ordinance require a variance to height and to actual sign
8 surface area. The store would need a 32 foot 4 inch total sign surface area variance
9 because he wants a 62 square foot sign which is double what they can have by our
10 ordinance. The ordinance allows a sign totalling 32 square feet total sign surface
11 area. The sign is proposed to be a six feet four inches and only five feet is allowed
12 in that area. Mr. Ewald did not submit any landscaping plans with this request so no
13 bonuses were applied. Looking at commercial sites it is difficult to say that Goodyear
14 meets hardship.
15
16 Commissioner Madden asked if Goodyear was aware of bonuses for landscaping and
17 Mr. Ewald indicated the company in Ohio wanted him to submit the request as is.
18 Commissioner Madden measured the existing landscaping area and indicated it was
19 about 130 square feet. The City Manager indicated Goodyear would have to dress up
20 the landscaping and submit a landscape plan to qualify for a bonus.
21
22 The City Manager responded to inquiry from Commissioner Makowske regarding the
3 position of the current ground sign. The new ground sign wasn't marked on the map
4 but would be taking the same location as the existing one.
25
26 Commissioner Thompson indicated he believed there was a little degree of hardship
27 because when travelling down the road from the north if you make the light you don't
28 see Goodyear because of the fence and water tower unless you get up parallel to it
29 and being that it is set way back in the backwall I think there is a degree of hardship
30 coming from that direction. He indicated he believed the Hardee's sign to be
31 intimidating because it is much larger.
32
33 The City Manager noted that is one of the reasons he would like to go through and
34 review the ground sign ordinance because many signs have never been measured.
35 Commissioner Makowske inquired to the way the agenda was set up regarding
36 granting a variance that under our review of the ground sign ordinance if we were to
37 make any changes there then Goodyear might actually conform. The City Manager
38 indicated if you denied Goodyear's request and then recommended change to the
39 ordinance it would take three readings of the ordinance before it became law. The
40 City Manager believed Goodyear just wanted to get a sign.
41
42 Chair Faust indicated that this application has caused the Planning Commission to
43 look at the ordinance to see if change would be recommended.
44
05
6
�`. PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 4
4
5 The City Manager discussed Goodyear's landscaping regarding the ground sign. It you
6 lowered the sign four inches it would be eight square feet more sign surface area.
7 GoodYear would still need to reduce the total size of the sign. They can have a total
8 of 40 square feet of sign surface area and Mr. Ewald is requesting 62 square feet. So
9 Goodyear would still need a variance.
10
11 Commissioner Franzese indicated the total square footage of the Hardee's sign was
12 64.44 feet and thought this was relevant because the other signs in the area have to
13 compete with the Hardee's sign.
14
15 David Ewald spoke on behalf of Goodyear in Ohio. He serves as Executive Director
16 of the Minnesota Sign Association and in that capacity he has been exposed to
17 ordinances ranging from Minneapolis-St. Paul to Effe and Big Fork so he sees a good
18 number of ordinances and has access to a number of materials from other organizations
19 in different states. Mr. Ewald indicated that Goodyear would like to make the hardship
20 argument because some of the other signage in the area is larger. The new manager of
21 the Goodyear store wants to re-landscape. The second issue for hardship is the
22 advance warning you need to enter the store. It is very inconvenient and you must
make a u-turn. (Mr. Ewald distributed a letter visibility chart.) The letters Goodyear
1'4 is proposing in signage are actually smaller than smallest letters on chart and indicated
25 a well-defined one inch letter can be read from approximately 40 feet away.
26 Goodyear's proposed sign would have visibility of 360 feet which Mr. Ewald does not
27 feel excessive given the advance decisions that people need to make to get into that
28 store.
29
30 Goodyear has been at that location since 1974 and is a good corporate citizen and a
31 stable base of tax paying business. Mr. Ewald indicated Goodyear's main concern was
32 the ground sign.
33
34 Commissioner Franzese inquired about the corporate colors of Goodyear and Mr.
35 Ewald explained the colors are light blue and yellow with gray.
36
37 Commissioner Makowske asked what hours the sign would be illuminated and Mr.
38 Ewald responded he was not sure of the hours but would be the same as the current
39 sign.
40
41 Commissioner Thompson indicated he felt St. Anthony needed to keep healthy business
42 climate because of the recent loss of two oil stations. He felt they needed improvement
43 on the signs there.
The public hearing was closed at 7:31 P.M..
1PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
02 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 5
4
5
6 Discussion by Commissioners.
7
8 Commissioner Bergstrom indicated that he felt the Commission had the cart before the
9 horse. He thought it would be appropriate to table this item until the Commission
10 had a discussion of ground signs.
11
12 Commissioner Franzese indicated she found a hardship because Goodyear is set so far
13 back from the road and the distance is intensified by the coloration of the signage next
14 to Hardee's and the fact that you have to have advance warning to make the u-turn to
15 get into the business from the south.
16
17 Commissioner Gondorchin indicated he was not in favor of granting Goodyear a wall
18 sign because there would be two plus the fact that Goodyear appears across the garage
19 door. The Commissioner recommended Goodyear simply make the ground sign
20 larger making use of landscaping bonuses available.
21
22 Chair Faust indicated he did not support a variance because he does not find hardship
4 3 and indicated his concern for setting precedents for other businesses.
4
25 Commissioner Madden indicated he saw a hardship and agreed with Commissioner
26 Franzese regarding the visibility factor neighboring businesses have due to much
27 larger signs. He indicated that he was alarmed about the eroding tax base in the area
28 and felt the City needed to encourage business and jobs. He indicated he felt granting
29 a ground sign was a very small price to pay to keep a business.
30
31 Commissioner Makowske agreed with everyone regarding the wall sign and indicated
32 he did see a hardship because of the setback and current sign visibility. He indicated
33 he spoke with the manager of Goodyear and who was anxious to have a new sign and
34 make improvements.
35
36 Commissioner Franzese indicated she was in favor of Goodyear's request for a second
37 sign because when you pass the building you don't look at the ground sign and
38 because of the setback location. Commissioner Madden indicated he believed Mr.
39 Ewald withdrew his request for a second sign and Mr. Ewald affirmed_.
40
41 Motion by Franzese, seconded by Madden that the Planning Commission recommend
42 to the Council to grant a variance to replace the existing Goodyear ground sign. It
43 should be replaced with one that would be four inches lower than the measurements
44 submitted with a height no greater than six feet with the condition that there must be
45 landscaping in order to take advantage of the bonus situation and after which there
06
I PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
2 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 6
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5
6 would be a necessity for a 22 square foot variance. That recommendation is based on
7 the fact that no one appeared to speak against the sign and that it satisfies the three
8 conditions required for passage of a variance. The hardship consists of several
9 factors (1) distant of business from road; (2) coloration of the sign is lacking in
10 intensity next to surrounding signs; (3) visibility blockage when coming from north;
11 (4) a u-tum is required when coming from the south in entrance to the property; (5)
12 the neighboring sign is much larger; (6) the business has been a long contributor to
13 our tax base; and (7) traffic speed.
14
15 The City Manager asked that for further variances the Planning Commission
16 reconsider the color of the sign as being a hardship.
17
18 Commissioner Franzese withdrew coloration of the Goodyear sign as being a
19 hardship.
20
21 Voting on the motion for ground sign only:
22
23 Aye: Commissioners Thompson, Franzese, Madden, and Makowske
0-4 Nay: Commissioners Bergstrom, Gondorchin, and Chair Faust
25
26 Motion carried.
27
28 That motion will go before the City Council on December 13, 1993 and Chair Faust
29 advised Mr. Ewald to be at the meeting because the Council has the ability to either
30 reject, accept or modify it to any desires that they so see fit.
31
32 Commissioner Franzese asked Mr. Ewald to check with.Goodyear regarding hours of
33 illumination and Mr. Ewald indicated he would withdraw the application for a second
34 sign at this time.
35
36 VI. MISCELLANEOUS.
37
38 A. Cadwallader's Realty World, 3800 Apache Lane; sign variance request.
39
40 The City Manager informed the Commission that Jake Cadwallader wanted him to go
41 to New Brighton to see a pylon sign that looks like a for sale sign and the City
42 Manager indicated to him that pylon signs are not permitted and suggested that there
43 is room to put a wall sign on his building. Mr. Cadwallader was not happy and said
44 he would get back to the City Manager but didn't until November 16th and asked that .
45 we continue the matter in December.
06
PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
3 'NOVEMBER 16, 1993
4 PAGE 7
5
6
7 B. Tan Me.
8
9 The City Manager indicated Tan Me in Apache was purchased and the new owners
10 wants to change hours. The City Manager wasn't sure if hours were ever established
11 so he doesn't know if they would be changing conditional use.
12
13 C. Scott Barton.
14
15 The City Manager indicated Scott Barton will be present at the next meeting regarding
16 moving his garage. The City Manager suggested that in the future we change the
17 requirement of appearing before a public hearing to move a shed or garage on a
18 person's own property.
19
20 D. Review Ground Sign Ordinance.
21
22 The City Manager discussed the ground signs and how difficult it is to prove hardship.
He said if there is going to be a variance there has to be a good reason. The City
4 Manager felt landscaping should be mandatory and to get ground sign a landscaping
25 plan should also be submitted. He indicated he though the size of the sign should be
26 determined by property size not neighboring signs. The ordinance reads you.can have
27 one wall sign and one ground sign. The City Manager indicated he and his assistant
28 will start an inventory of ground signs and catalog the different sizes and shapes.
29
30 Chair Faust welcomed Chris Makowske on the Commission. Commissioner
31 Makowske indicated he was a life-long resident of St. Anthony and very pleased to be
32 part of the Commission because it is a tradition in his family to give back to community
33 which has formed you.
34
35 Commissioners Comments.
36'
37 Commissioner Madden inquired if there was any news on Cub.
38
39 The City Manager responded that he met with them last week and that the most positive
40 news was that they hade budgeted for the St. Anthony Cub store in 1994 as well as.a
41 store in Robbinsdale. The footage would be 50,000-88,000 square feet depending on
42 ownership. Cub is looking at late October of 1994 to open. The City Manager
43 indicated that he and the Mayor stressed to SuperValu that the residents appear to want
only a Cub. A final decision will be made during the Fall of 1993.
I PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 8
4
5
6 Commissioner Franzese wanted to congratulate the City for holding down taxes. She
7 also encouraged everyone to write representatives regarding the library and said the St.
8 Anthony library consumes only 1% of total library bill.
9
10 Commissioner Franzese also inquired about the future of City Hall and the City
11 Manager responded that building wasn't feasible right now with all the other projects.
12 He indicated the two new officers starting the first of the year will be in the expanded
13 space in the police department.
14
15 Commissioner Franzese indicated she was in contact with the owner of free standing
16 business being bought out and the owner wanted to know what kind of incentives there
17 are to encourage the new owner to come to St. Anthony. Commissioner Franzese
18 welcomed any ideas from anyone.
19
20 Commissioner Thompson commented on the new dental building which he believed
21 was going to be super asset to the Village. He has observed the quality construction
22 and landscaping.
*4 Commissioner Bergstrom reported the Environmental Task Force scheduled to have a
25 quarterly meeting this Thursday touring an incinerator downtown has been postponed.
26
27 Commissioner Makowske wanted to encourage people to make the library meeting or
28 write representatives in Hennepin County.
29
30 Commissioner Franzese felt that the City Council should communicate with Hennepin
31 County the strong desirability of voting to retain library. Commissioner Madden
32 indicated that they had already done so.
33
34 The City Manager indicated Mary Jo McGuire and John Marty wrote letters to each
35 county commissioner. Senator Marty indicated that he would be in touch personally
36 with those he knew and talk to them about keeping it open. The Council has sent
37 letters and tried to get in touch with the majority of members and the Mayor will be
38 making a speech at the meeting.
39
40 Commissioner Gondorchin commented that tax statements were showing 10-12%
41 increase in St. Anthony and felt this was because St. Anthony has been experiencing a
42 loss in taxable value. Almost every commercial and industrial property has had taxes
43 lowered. The 1980s values were up high and with recession they came down.
Everybody is paying more in taxes and it is affecting all of us. Commissioner
4W Gondorchin stated that.St. Anthony has to get the tax base back up because that's the
I PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
2 NOVEMBER 16, 1993
3 PAGE 9
4
5 only way they can afford building roads. The Commissioner stressed the fact how
6 crucial the new Cub store will be to the City.
7
8 VII. ADJOURNMENT.
9
10 Motion by Chair Faust and seconded by Commissioner Franzese to adjourn meeting at
11 8:40 p.m.
12
13 Motion carried unanimously:
14
15
16
17 Respectfully submitted,
18
19
20
21 Margaret A. Noyd
22 Planning Commission Secretary
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